Concerning recent discoveries about the US government

[Josheh]

New york is so safe..

[This Babylon]

I love some of the ignorance in this thread, both american and non-american. So eager to give up your privacy and fight the muslims!

I swore oaths to defend the peoples rights. Not a bigwigs seat. I would rather die  on my feet than live on my knees. However with the current state of global affairs I would say some tapping is warranted on potential terrorist threats. That being said if they start arresting people solely on suspicion or because of a political agenda then we have a major problem.

Oh wait

Al also to add a bit of understanding argument to the point I was trying to make, I am not saying "Obama r Hitlar". I'm simply trying to say we are going down a slippery slope to possibly becoming a police state.

[Al]

Why must you think our government is always conspiring against us?

@Rachel What does gun crime by state have to do with our privacy problem? I'm talking about whether or not it's ethical in our evolving technological society for certain information to be open to them.

Going back more on topic...I think the folks at Google are doing us some good by not releasing user info and going forward to appeal, so safe to say they already think this is unconstitutional. And I agree that anyone can't just snoop in anyone's stuff if they aren't comfortable with it, it's like natural law.

I've come up with a possible solution...I think that the govt. needs more due process to access profiles and records. Want information? Tell us why, and we'll be glad to help you out, because lives are at stake. Instead of them walking up to Google and adjusting their belts and saying, we're gonna need all user information. I think it seems a little exaggerating to build a big building and hoard 350M's people's info but again I don't think they'll be doing that.

[This Babylon]

Why must you think our government is always conspiring against us?

Im not even going to argue or explain anything else to you al, youve already drank the cool aid

[Pacman Syu]

Goodness! This is such a good discussion. Let's not start a flame war here, okay?

The problem is that the government uses every opportunity to take away rights we have.
They can do it because they say it is for our safety.

This is just a reference about state crimes.  Some of it is pretty out of date but the idea is there.
Not all states are equal when it comes to crimes committed. 









If you consider that most of our gun crimes are done by repeat offenders these number could be lower if we made it harder to get out of jails.  Problem is that more of our jails are filled with drug users or fraud.  We probably put more people in jail for things other countries would fine them for or is legal.

About taking away our rights in the name of safety, this was in the news the other day: http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-57589199-94/kill-switch-sought-as-answer-to-phone-theft-epidemic/

You would have to be a complete dolt to think that theft is the only factor of the equation.

Why must you think our government is always conspiring against us?

@Rachel What does gun crime by state have to do with our privacy problem? I'm talking about whether or not it's ethical in our evolving technological society for certain information to be open to them.

Going back more on topic...I think the folks at Google are doing us some good by not releasing user info and going forward to appeal, so safe to say they already think this is unconstitutional. And I agree that anyone can't just snoop in anyone's stuff if they aren't comfortable with it, it's like natural law.

I've come up with a possible solution...I think that the govt. needs more due process to access profiles and records. Want information? Tell us why, and we'll be glad to help you out, because lives are at stake. Instead of them walking up to Google and adjusting their belts and saying, we're gonna need all user information. I think it seems a little exaggerating to build a big building and hoard 350M's people's info but again I don't think they'll be doing that.

I will proudly admit that overall, Google is a good company when it comes to privacy. However, they did drop the ball in this situation. They are being very apologetic about it, but I'm afraid that it's a little more of an act than I'd like to believe. I completely agree with your last paragraph though. You have my vote.

[Rachellove9]

I agree about that not being about theft alone.
Honestly people have been stealing for years.
The criminals will figure a way around this.
I think this is more of a way to quiet people to call out to others if they choose it would be better to block the calls.
They may not want pictures of certain types of things being shared either.

[Pacman Syu]

I agree about that not being about theft alone.
Honestly people have been stealing for years.
The criminals will figure a way around this.
I think this is more of a way to quiet people to call out to others if they choose it would be better to block the calls.
They may not want pictures of certain types of things being shared either.

My libertarian views might be showing a little too clearly, but I think it's completely up to the people to protect themselves from phone theft. I don't expect the government to hold my hand for some < $500 object. In the scheme of things, that's an entirely miniscule amount. There's better ways to protect our stolen belongings anyway, like the Prey Project: http://preyproject.com/

[Note: this is a little side-tracked, but still related]
I consider myself more political than the average person, but I'm certainly no political genius. However, I believe there's something I've learned before many others do. That is that politics can help prevent problems, but is rarely the answer.
As long as there are people who are willing to act immorally, they will act immoral.
Taking away guns won't stop people from killing each other - only from killing each other with guns (though we know that could never be the case in the US anyway).
As soon as the government figures out one way to remove piracy, that method is already outdated.
People who will do what is wrong will have no problem breaking rules. Instead of focusing on banning and controlling everything, maybe we ought to just strive to be better people.

edit: BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN BE APATHETIC TOWARDS YOUR GOVERNMENT!

edit 2: http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/305765-senators-skip-classified-briefing-on-nsa-snooping-to-catch-flights-home It's crap like this, folks.

[This Babylon]

Goodness! This is such a good discussion. Let's not start a flame war here, okay?

Not starting shit, just pointing out the obvious fact that he is living in la la land about this.

edit: 420 POST do u evn blaze it fgt

[Al]

Goodness! This is such a good discussion. Let's not start a flame war here, okay?

Not starting shit, just pointing out the obvious fact that he is living in la la land about this.

edit: 420 POST do u evn blaze it fgt

Not sure why but that edit part made me lol.

Further discussion:

On if the government has a evil hidden agenda, there's hints here and there that makes it hard for me to believe they would conspire against the average citizen. There's always been some kind of act to lessen government secrecy, like the Freedom of Information Act (and just surfing through Wikipedia, others as well).

Remember Zero Dark Thirty? I know it's a movie, but take in point that these people work in offices, and regular people work there, all the "government" officials are all regular citizens just like I said, and I'm sure somebody, somewhere, somehow (bad) secrets would get leaked. Someone would say something. Somebody would know. Can you imagine what would happen if the American public found out? That right there just makes me think how absurd it is to say our president is a Hitler, the government is taking powers away from us average citizens.

Just in one hour ago: "NSA admits listening to U.S. phone calls without warrants
National Security Agency discloses in secret Capitol Hill briefing that thousands of analysts can listen to domestic phone calls. That authorization appears to extend to e-mail and text messages too."

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-57589495-38/nsa-admits-listening-to-u.s-phone-calls-without-warrants/

It's hard to keep things secret.

edit: btw these are the videos i wanted you guys to watch:

A Brief History of the USA - Bowling for Columbine - Michael Moore

What a wonderfull world

To add to the point that like the movie portrays, the US has always been "scared."

[This Babylon]

Al the latter video is the exact reason behind my logic, we do so much bad shit its not even funny, its like noone gives a fuck anymore and its all about personal gain/ the gains of the country rather than gains to the world society as a whole. If they did that much shit, what makes you think they wont do it over here for their own political power / dominance to further support their own greed?

[Al]

Al the latter video is the exact reason behind my logic, we do so much bad shit its not even funny, its like noone gives a fuck anymore and its all about personal gain/ the gains of the country rather than gains to the world society as a whole. If they did that much shit, what makes you think they wont do it over here for their own political power / dominance to further support their own greed?

So why are you against what I'm saying? Did you read what I wrote?

I said the government snooping in our shit is not cool, and used Google as an example and said at least they're doing their part.

[Josheh]

This is a wonderful topic, peoples opinions are being expressed and no one is specifically attacking each other. Just wanted to give you all a high-five for that.

:woeh: :woeh:

I would like to express a short opinion that I'm very angry that the american government thinks it is okay to spy, yes spy, on me and my doings.

[i mr420]

I'm just gonna say I live in America and first of all not all those companies share data with the government. example 1: apple is fighting the united states grand jury right now because they don't want to unlock someone's phone so the government can check it. this statement along almost brings down this entire thing. 1 false statement in this topic and it could all be false. in all honesty any government is gonna do what they want, that's what power is. and example 2: with some parts of this topic already proven "wrong" how much is actually right? you will never know governments have a way of keeping their business un detected all this is, is a conspiracy theory nothing more actually could be even less than that. and as far as "spying" goes your a fool to think some governments don't look into peoples life's or at least certain people's life's which is spying none the less. so don't say America is wrong for doing it cause yes they are but any government with the slightest bit of power is going to spy that's just how the world is gonna be with 7billiion plus people.

[PineappleTom]

This was discussed in 2013, please create a new topic if you wish to discuss this again. Many of these posters will not read your comments.

I've locked it to save confusion :)