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"You are a Wilderness Guardian. That northern wasteland; that land of blood, desolation and death is your dominion. Tonight we are going home." ~His Lordship |
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Posted: January 3, 2010 10:38 am  | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
      IRC Nickname: Maths Group: Ex-Member Posts: 1855 Member No.: 54 Joined: December 31, 2007 Total Events Attended: 286    | We're shit in wars. WG members honestly aren't getting interested in warring, no matter what a lot of us do. At the moment, we honestly have a very select 10-15 people who turn up to most (if not all) wars + actually know what they're doing. Do remember that oldschool WG did not have an "event leader" rank, instead having "community leader" and "moderator". The only reason EL rank is in place now is because its left over from the breaking up of the skills sector. My suggestion is to remove EL rank + replace it with moderator. Face it, EL's (I'm sorry), but they're not doing a ton atm. The occasional event here + there and random things like "skill of the week". But face it, not a whole lot of people like doing a lot of those events. Primarily, WG is a pking clan with skilling on the side. You've been told this + none of you have picked up the game in warring. We still have shitty pulls, shitty tanks, shitty binds, shitty anti snipe. All of you don't really care a ton because you know you can go back to skilling later, and there'll be another 4-5 people skilling as well. Time to step up. Time to distinguish ourselves as a pking clan. Removing the event leader rank would somewhat show that we're actually into our warring, and it is the MAIN focus of WG. We can still have side events, but they should be nowhere near as important as an actual war/pkri. As a side note, put in a training requirement for < 115 cmb members. 2-3 f2p cmb levels a month, until 115 cmb. And while you're at it, raise requirements to 105. Face it, we get raped because every single decent f2p pking clan has at least a 120 average. WG however, is still stuck in 2007, thinking 117/118 f2p will cut it in today's clan world. Our strength may be in numbers, but I can tell you now 10 lvl 110's will lose again 8 lvl 120's from another clan. Think about it. Warring used to be what brought us together. It used to be what made this clan strong. It worked. Atm a lot of you don't care about warring performance. Side suggestions - warn/kick members who aren't improving. That is all. --------------------  "Journeys are what brings us happiness, Not the destination." ~ Two time ex-raid leader of wg ~  | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 10:42 am | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: leecable Group: Banned Posts: 1938 Member No.: 410 Joined: April 1, 2008 Total Events Attended: 178 | Completely agree. --------------------    | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 10:46 am | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: ThisIsUnique Group: Ex-Member Posts: 1664 Member No.: 1417 Joined: October 30, 2008 Total Events Attended: 141 | EL's cant do shit anyway, People arent interested enough in normal events. Theyre lazy these days. They wont put that little extra effort in clan. --------------------   | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 11:17 am | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: megajayson Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 9246 Member No.: 423 Joined: April 4, 2008 Total Events Attended: 216 |
wat i agree i guess. EL's these days just seem to want to run 'comps' n shit, i barely see any events. EL's used to have to make daily events, and none of this comp crap for attendance --------------------  This is ten percent luck, twenty percent skill Fifteen percent concentrated power of will Five percent pleasure, fifty percent pain And a hundred percent reason to remember the name! 7th Highest Overall for Wars Attended. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 11:40 am | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Vephy Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 6186 Member No.: 813 Joined: June 10, 2008 Total Events Attended: 478 | I just haven't done it right. Events are meant to be about getting the community together. Let that be clear. I don't want anyone thinking otherwise especially event leaders... --------------------   | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 11:57 am | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Billy|Gilli Group: Ex-Member Posts: 1545 Member No.: 1451 Joined: November 9, 2008 Total Events Attended: 91 | Completely agree, and to top it off, where were the 3 event leaders at the pkri yesterday? --------------------    | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 12:32 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Kwaichi Group: Ex-Member Posts: 1827 Member No.: 65 Joined: December 31, 2007 Total Events Attended: 119 | No matter how the ranked is named like, they always have to do the same job. --------------------  | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 12:46 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: megajayson Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 9246 Member No.: 423 Joined: April 4, 2008 Total Events Attended: 216 |
wat. so EL's do the same as trial guardian. mmk -------------------- This is ten percent luck, twenty percent skill Fifteen percent concentrated power of will Five percent pleasure, fifty percent pain And a hundred percent reason to remember the name! 7th Highest Overall for Wars Attended. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 02:18 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Mickey Group: Emeritus Posts: 5305 Member No.: 48 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 282 |
He means that no matter what you call Event Leader, they will have to do the same job. I can't say I disagree with what you're suggesting, though. --------------------    | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 02:37 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Snowzak Group: Emeritus Posts: 1193 Member No.: 5 Joined: December 26, 2007 Total Events Attended: 67 | Removing the EL rank won't solve warring problems. I don't know what will though. I just think the Wars/Skills tension that WG has been living on is nearing it's end. Lordy's very attached to the skills aspect of the clan - it's perhaps the longest debate which has been going on in WG, and one which successive officials have failed to win against him. It's the fatality of specialization: most of the clans out there specialize in PKing. Some of them specialize in skilling. Nobody really claims doing both anymore... Whatever is needed to improve in warring, it starts in a redefinition of the whole purpose of WG. WG's a very old clan, with outdated credos and even an outdated name. If we specialize, it'll mean a chance for improvement. If we specialize, it'll also mean putting ourselves at risk: we would be making WG no different than all the other clans out there. Once we specialize, it would mean not doing it the half-assed way. It'd mean giving up a lot of what WG has been about. It should be a WG v.2.0. But radical changes in WG are always an enormous risk. Beware of the pedobear - what he wants is his clan to survive. And he'll go great lengths to ensure it stays the way he wants it. Even if it means dumping half the clan, or more... This pattern is constantly coming back: - a knot of dedicated, active, war-skilled pkers tries pulling a thoroughly inactive WG to clanworld standards - officials try to radicalize WG by specializing it in PKing - lordy comes back from inactivity and brings out the big guns (all the clan history parts where "His Lordship puts the clan back on track") - the knot of skilled pkers leave to top clans - and we're back to the starting point ---------- Without this cycle, if WG had specialized and kept all it's skilled pkers, WG could have over 60 active 120+. Thus caution is much needed at the moment: make sure to keep unity in transition. --------------------  London RL Meeting attendee - Paris RL meeting attendee Joined WG in October 2005 - Original DG - Ex-Raid Leader Proud Council Member from October 21st 2007 to May 19th 2008 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 03:37 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: megajayson Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 9246 Member No.: 423 Joined: April 4, 2008 Total Events Attended: 216 | this is why i love zak and his top hat -------------------- This is ten percent luck, twenty percent skill Fifteen percent concentrated power of will Five percent pleasure, fifty percent pain And a hundred percent reason to remember the name! 7th Highest Overall for Wars Attended. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 03:46 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 7306 Member No.: 47 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 343 | Maybe if we replaced with raid leaders  -------------------- July 5, 2007 - June 27, 2011 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 04:14 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Stokenut Group: Guest Posts: 2062 Member No.: 805 Joined: June 10, 2008 Total Events Attended: 112 | Maths for council. If WG wasn't so democratic we could just kick the ones who don't pull their weight. -------------------- Over 6 years of history and friendship, deleted over a difference in an opinion. --- Challenge any creationist to a debate. They'll run away and aggressively accuse you of "attacking" them and their "beliefs". I'm sorry, please, keep teaching our kids that they'll burn in hell if they don't believe. Mutilate their genitals against their will while you're at it. Keep influencing politics and holding back vital scientific research. I'll just keep my mouth shut to "respect" your "beliefs". | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 04:24 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Snowzak Group: Emeritus Posts: 1193 Member No.: 5 Joined: December 26, 2007 Total Events Attended: 67 |
Democracy isn't adapted to clans. And perhaps only you can convince Lordy it's time to abandon his principles. Moderate fascism is more like it. -------------------- London RL Meeting attendee - Paris RL meeting attendee Joined WG in October 2005 - Original DG - Ex-Raid Leader Proud Council Member from October 21st 2007 to May 19th 2008 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 06:23 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: rachellove Group: Council Posts: 6955 Member No.: 173 Joined: January 31, 2008 Total Events Attended: 305 | I don't know that getting rid of the rank is the answer, unless we make all the current EL to be Raid leaders. Then each of the raid leaders agrees to make one community event a week along with leading raids as needed. That includes the 4 current raid leaders too. Everyone would need to agree as this is not the positions that they applied for. But the future of WG will be dramatically changed. A lot more thought needs to go into such a dramatic decision. Steve, we need to keep the semi democratic system we have in place. The clan does make good decisions more often than bad ones. Not everything is a vote as it is now. The Founder/Council has some decisions to just make too. Rachy --------------------  Thank you Garrett and Dallar. “The day soldiers stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them. They have either lost confidence that you can help them or concluded that you do not care. Either case is a failure of leadership.” ~~Colin Powell ~~  | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 06:29 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Jenny Group: Emeritus Posts: 1967 Member No.: 19 Joined: December 29, 2007 Total Events Attended: 56 | I have often thought the democratic process was over-rated in WG. Things can be too fair minded at times. --------------------   | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 06:31 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: rachellove Group: Council Posts: 6955 Member No.: 173 Joined: January 31, 2008 Total Events Attended: 305 |
QFT I see this. -------------------- Thank you Garrett and Dallar. “The day soldiers stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them. They have either lost confidence that you can help them or concluded that you do not care. Either case is a failure of leadership.” ~~Colin Powell ~~ | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 3, 2010 07:27 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: DG_Keanu Group: Council Posts: 4782 Member No.: 2033 Joined: August 25, 2009 Total Events Attended: 173 | You see what I was on about George?  --------------------  [05:42] <+WG_Keanu> I think I got a semi just looking at the pic [05:42] <%kat> same | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 4, 2010 01:16 am | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 7306 Member No.: 47 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 343 |
and they can be bias also -------------------- July 5, 2007 - June 27, 2011 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 4, 2010 02:27 am | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Lefty Group: Emeritus Posts: 3340 Member No.: 1055 Joined: June 30, 2008 Total Events Attended: 211 |
Also QFT --------------------      | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 4, 2010 03:35 am | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: DG_Keanu Group: Council Posts: 4782 Member No.: 2033 Joined: August 25, 2009 Total Events Attended: 173 |
This bit is the best though. -------------------- [05:42] <+WG_Keanu> I think I got a semi just looking at the pic [05:42] <%kat> same | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 4, 2010 10:20 am | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: RobbieThe1st Group: Founder Posts: 770 Member No.: 2 Joined: December 26, 2007 Total Events Attended: 49 | Honestly, Snowzak, that was a great post. It brings up our circle quite well. However, I disagree with the conclusion. Personally, I'm OK with WG not being a great PK clan. I am here because we are different. We -aren't- the best PK clan, but we are the most unique. We have our ideals, outdated though they may be. But, no matter what you say about us, we are WG. We stick around, through thick and through thin, and we don't die simply because our PK-loving fringe doesn't like things as they are and leaves. Instead, we stay solid. If we changed to become a PK-centered clan, would we be WG? We might have the name, but we wouldn't be the clan. -------------------- Old Avatar - Paypal donation link  I am left handed, and proud of it! Retired from RuneScape. Old forum posts: 2275(s4+s10+wg.com)+1759(z6 old account)+474(z6 new account) Total: 4508 Join date: 4/16/05 | Get Firefox 3.5 now: http://www.getfirefox.com | RobbieSwich for Firefox | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 4, 2010 01:04 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Snowzak Group: Emeritus Posts: 1193 Member No.: 5 Joined: December 26, 2007 Total Events Attended: 67 | I'm not trying to conclude anything except that whichever decision is taken, it should be cautious of consequences. I'm also trying to underline that there isn't a way to be "half-PK-centered" anymore. It's 1 or 0, black or white. We can't wobble through victories over PK centered clans by not being PK centered. Look, we lost enormous ground. A year ago we were like top 30. Now we're struggling to stay in the top 100, because clans of 50 active PK centered people can beat the shit out of us. The great paradox of WG is that the fact we're not PK centered makes us survive, but at the cost of being crappy PK wise. There's a difficult choice to make, and both will involve sacrifices. But going the non PK centered way isn't viable anymore: it is victories and glories that bring new people to a clan nowadays, that's what is most visible. Not community & skill events. The website brings people here. But only first time clanners who type "clan" in google, which we have to educate to clanning. But we don't keep great members we've trained to clanning because we don't specialize enough in PKing. -------------------- London RL Meeting attendee - Paris RL meeting attendee Joined WG in October 2005 - Original DG - Ex-Raid Leader Proud Council Member from October 21st 2007 to May 19th 2008 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 4, 2010 02:17 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Maths Group: Ex-Member Posts: 1855 Member No.: 54 Joined: December 31, 2007 Total Events Attended: 286 | Thank you dear snowzak, for you are a very smart man. Reading it again, I honestly agree with everything you say. Its either black or white. WG needs to pick what they want to be. WG can't be a mix right now. We've been doing that for the last 2 years, and we haven't gotten anywhere. We've just gone down. 06 - WG in its pking prime 07 - WG starts to lower (top 30?) 08 - WG lowers more (top 50?) 09 - WG lowers even more (top 100?) 10 - WG who? What WG has been doing as a clan, has failed. You've had it your way for way too long, trying to combine skilling + pking. Time to step up, make the clan focus primarily on pking. Otherwise, this clan will fall even more. Don't expect to keep all of us around when you've made the decision. Depending upon it, some will leave, some will stay. It needs to be done, so WG can actually make a name for itself. -------------------- "Journeys are what brings us happiness, Not the destination." ~ Two time ex-raid leader of wg ~ | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Posted: January 4, 2010 02:20 pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: XLord CaimX Group: Ex-Member Posts: 180 Member No.: 2118 Joined: November 3, 2009 Total Events Attended: 25 | i agree, EL rank should be removed and the rl's in place should raid more. --------------------    | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Remove EL rank?