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Posted: October 14, 2008 03:19 am  | |||||||||
     IRC Nickname: Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 7306 Member No.: 47 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 343    | Everyone's had their say. I have yet to see a new argument and if you read it Vince makes a fair point. To each his own, I don't complain about skillers not coming to wars so don't complain about my desires. -------------------- July 5, 2007 - June 27, 2011 | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 05:52 am | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Sativas Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 2255 Member No.: 1305 Joined: August 29, 2008 Total Events Attended: 155 |
Pretty much says it all. Unless someone skips a mandatory event for a random one I don't really see the issue. The overlapping of the two event could of been prevented I guess. --------------------  The Ultimate Skilling and Combat Badges Updated June 17th, 2011        | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 09:36 am | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Mistah_Vince Group: Ex-Member Posts: 2235 Member No.: 233 Joined: February 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 85 |
It's not even about that anymore. Well, unless somebody drags that back in. Of course that could have been prevented, but this topic was veering into one of our old classics of "Skillers VS Warrers" so I made my statement before it continued. From what I understand, the PKRI wasn't totally planned, but it was part of the War Practice. Regardless, what difference does it make? All the "War-Mongers" as they're called were at that Training Event, and I doubt many Skillers were there. And in the other aspect, I doubt many "War-Mongers" were at the Skilling event. So whether they were overlapped didn't matter that much, because the groups of people attending the event were totally different. Now, I don't know that for a fact because I wasn't at EITHER of the events, but I'm still stating my mind about it. --------------------   | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 10:34 am | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: rachellove Group: Council Posts: 6955 Member No.: 173 Joined: January 31, 2008 Total Events Attended: 305 | Seems we went through this kind of stuff not long ago with Old school vs New school. Fighting amoung ourselves. Maybe just give the war people what they want with more wars and not make those who don't want to fight be involved in any way. It would be better for them to have 10 people show up who really love and are great at it then to have 35 people show up with 10 people wanting to be there and they lose. It has come down to my being more careful of who I even recruit for the clan. Basically it is suggested unless they are war people don't do it. I think that is fine cause as it is suggested they want to be on rsc and get glory and stuff. I want to have friends myself. It is not really skiller against war person. Cause look at some of the war people's skills. Some of them have better skills then then myself. Joe I personally don't hide to not attend. I would not be mad if you had 10 wars a day and went to all of them. I just don't want to come to any of them anymore. In my opinion I should never have to mandatory war. Tabs and Muggers your both staff and maybe could handle differences better. I can see both sides of your arguements. Tabs, I don't believe that this one event caused you to post on here. It probably has more to do with a build up of things that have happened over time. Gather your information and go to council. --------------------  Thank you Garrett and Dallar. “The day soldiers stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them. They have either lost confidence that you can help them or concluded that you do not care. Either case is a failure of leadership.” ~~Colin Powell ~~  | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 03:14 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Geofff Group: Clan Friend Posts: 1238 Member No.: 608 Joined: May 12, 2008 Total Events Attended: 96 | Shouldn't pkri's automatically take place over a farming run?  --------------------  | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 03:21 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: rachellove Group: Council Posts: 6955 Member No.: 173 Joined: January 31, 2008 Total Events Attended: 305 |
Joel even Muggers would say no to that. It is not an issue of which is more important, but what was scheduled and the times they were scheduled. Muggers event was scheduled first and took longer than Tabs had thought it would take. It was a training event that PKRI runin ended up making it last longer. They are debating whether the add on of PKRI was part of the training event or not. -------------------- Thank you Garrett and Dallar. “The day soldiers stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them. They have either lost confidence that you can help them or concluded that you do not care. Either case is a failure of leadership.” ~~Colin Powell ~~ | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 03:35 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Rage|Mike Group: Clan Friend Posts: 1948 Member No.: 1238 Joined: July 29, 2008 Total Events Attended: 132 |
There is nothing to debate, the run in occurred during our FFA Arena practice, Abs himself said we only get ONE attendance Points which means its ONE event.
It should, since you can do farm runs any time a day, but when you have a run in with a clan, whats the odds of running into that clan again during the same day? Meh. --------------------  MSN: [email protected] IRC: Rage|Mike at SwiftIRC and SeersIRC Drop me a comment, click to view my RSC profile! Proud to be ex-Wilderness Guardian. | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 04:11 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Samurai-JM Group: Emeritus Posts: 3204 Member No.: 117 Joined: January 11, 2008 Total Events Attended: 8 | These events take a lot of planning, time, and effort to pull off. A random even can NEVER take precedence over something like that, I don't care how important you think it is. -------------------- -=}¤- Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici -¤{=-  W I N N I N G | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 04:23 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rage|Mike Group: Clan Friend Posts: 1948 Member No.: 1238 Joined: July 29, 2008 Total Events Attended: 132 |
It's not random, it was part of mugger's training event. -------------------- MSN: [email protected] IRC: Rage|Mike at SwiftIRC and SeersIRC Drop me a comment, click to view my RSC profile! Proud to be ex-Wilderness Guardian. | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 04:59 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Zlat Group: Clan Friend Posts: 2781 Member No.: 9 Joined: December 29, 2007 Total Events Attended: 60 | im amused how the same issues happen over and over again yet nobody learns from them. --------------------   | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 05:01 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rick Hamm Group: Ex-Member Posts: 573 Member No.: 1214 Joined: July 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 6 | and nobody is willing to do anything to ensure it don't happen again Zlat. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 05:11 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Trolls trolling trolls trolling trolls Group: Banned Posts: 2956 Member No.: 422 Joined: April 4, 2008 Total Events Attended: 130 |
Looks like someone hasn't read the whole topic XD  -------------------- Mugger84 Member Of WG Since 4th April 2008. WG Raid Leader Since 20th June 2008. WG Council Since 20th November 2008. Banned from WG Since 6th March 2009. DF IG Since 6th March 2009. DF FA Since 15th March 2009. Ex-Member Of WG Since 26th March 2009. Member of DF Since 6th April 2009. Clan Friend of WG Since 4th June 2009. --- ||Ex-WG Warlord || Current Member of DF || Ex-Rampage Leader ||  | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 05:30 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Dnovelta Group: Emeritus Posts: 2750 Member No.: 130 Joined: January 20, 2008 Total Events Attended: 137 | I'm on the fence here, because I can see two strong arguments, one for each side. The way I see it is this: you could argue that Mugger's event technically "ended" anp people made the conscious decision to not go to the skilling event (seeing as it's not mandatory). So yes, only one event attendance was handed out, simply because there really was only one event that could have technically ended on time. What I mean is this: - Mugger's event starts - 15-20 minutes of tanking practice in CWA - Switch to FFA - PKRI ensues during the FFA portion of the training session - Training session "ends" (as according to timetables) but PKRI continues - Attendees make the conscious decision to continue with the PKRI and abandon the skilling event Now, that is basically the best case scenario for those who in fact did keep on with the PKRI. The problem is that neither event is mandatory, so people can do what they want on their time. The only problem I could see is if the IRC started to be flooded with "Come to the PKRI right now!!!" during Tabs' event. That would have been wrong because of the fact it was unplanned, you shouldn't encourage people to just ditch a planned event. I agree with whoever said (Rick, I think it was you?) that if this situation happened in reverse, there would be much more aggravation. Had the farming runs gone a little off track and everyone making compost as well as gathering their crops and what ever could extend this I'm almost 100% certain that the we'd be getting "Your event was supposed to last X hours, because we had a war training event schedules. You should have kept to your time limit because it isn't fair to us. Warring is more important..." and the same stuff we've been hearing all the while. Planned events should always take precedence over unplanned, no matter how "important" the unplanned event may seem. I think what is really wrong here is that nobody really cares that Tabs' event was overshadowed. It's not really a matter of importance, but just fairness to her. --------------------   | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 05:36 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Samurai-JM Group: Emeritus Posts: 3204 Member No.: 117 Joined: January 11, 2008 Total Events Attended: 8 |
wtf is reading, the title says it all.  I was basically trying to say what Colonel just said, but he said it better. xD -------------------- -=}¤- Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici -¤{=- W I N N I N G | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 05:37 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rick Hamm Group: Ex-Member Posts: 573 Member No.: 1214 Joined: July 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 6 | I salute you Colonel. You were always one of the smart ones.  -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 05:43 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Dnovelta Group: Emeritus Posts: 2750 Member No.: 130 Joined: January 20, 2008 Total Events Attended: 137 |
I try. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 05:49 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 7306 Member No.: 47 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 343 | Warrers want to war so don't complain about our not attending your events when you don't ours. Neither are mandatory and I personally have stopped trying to get people to come since they'll find a way to avoid it they're determined. Skillers need to learn the same thing, if I want to go to a PKRI that should be my choice without a whole topic complaining. The skillers went to the skill event (if they weren't at the PKRI which is pretty likely and they didn't come to the skill event that's a different problem which you need to deal with) and the people interested in warring went to the PKRI. I really don't see why I should be forced to attend skill events when skillers aren't forced to attend war events. That's what you're trying to say, wars are not mandatory any more but skill events should be. No, it's free choice on what you attend, so if you have low attendance look at something else to blame besides people who want to war. Eg. Just because A happens before B doesn't mean it causes B, it could be a third factor C. In those terms, just because A (an unplanned PKRI) happens before B (planned skill event) doesn't mean the PKRI caused low attendance at B. The factor C is what you should be llooking at rather than reverting the oldest gripe of warring is steamrolling skills. -------------------- July 5, 2007 - June 27, 2011 | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 05:55 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rage|Mike Group: Clan Friend Posts: 1948 Member No.: 1238 Joined: July 29, 2008 Total Events Attended: 132 |
Agreed to be honest. -------------------- MSN: [email protected] IRC: Rage|Mike at SwiftIRC and SeersIRC Drop me a comment, click to view my RSC profile! Proud to be ex-Wilderness Guardian. | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 09:41 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Kiwi011 Group: Emeritus Posts: 3052 Member No.: 40 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 21 | I will give my view on this. The planned event, The War Training, WHICH HAD OCCURRED was extended to an UNPLANNED PKRI after the practice when it was clear a PLANNED Skill Event was taking place. The SKILL EVENT HAS BEEN SCHEDULED. The War Training was scheduled to be before the skill event. Both War Lords and Skill Leaders knew this in advance. The Warlords IMO should be *Punished/Lectured* because they directly caused a confrontation of events when the Skill event had already been planned BEFORE THE PKRI. The Warlords/Raid Leaders should next time make sure that next time their event doesn't clash with another or let the skill leaders/person who made the event that a PKRI may happen after the initial practice and allow some leniency on the time. I know you all love your wars, but when you blatantly ignore an event and make another one when an event is already scheduled and the times will override with another event that was scheduled you are being; Ignorant, Disrespectful, and ignoring the Wishes/Whims of other clan members who may actually enjoy both Skills and Wars. When you do that you ignore half of WG and destroy what WG is supposed to be. --------------------  | ||||||||
Posted: October 14, 2008 09:48 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Trolls trolling trolls trolling trolls Group: Banned Posts: 2956 Member No.: 422 Joined: April 4, 2008 Total Events Attended: 130 | I'm going to REPEAT what I have said, and I HOPE it will be read so that people can stop using their old 'war vs skill' buildup on this thread. To repeat: The War Training, Scheduled WAY in advance of the Skilling Event is WELL WITHIN it's rights to last one hour and 25 minutes. IN FACT, I have before hosted a two hour war training session. The war training exercise INCLUDED a trip into FFA for some Pile transition training, which consists of finding a big group of people, and killing them. By CHANCE, Exer (Or a bunch of friends including some exer) were there and it was taken to be a 'PKRI', but it was still essentially pile transition training. It was PART OF MY EVENT. (My Time Slot) I was 100% within my rights, and Tabs (Who origionally scheduled OVER my event, and then had to move it (she only moved it back by one hour, despite my war trainings usually lasting longer)) shouldn't have put her event so close to mine. It was bound to clash. Please stop using the standard 'i hate wars/skills' ethos here. It REALLY doesn't help the community. ~Mugger84 -------------------- Mugger84 Member Of WG Since 4th April 2008. WG Raid Leader Since 20th June 2008. WG Council Since 20th November 2008. Banned from WG Since 6th March 2009. DF IG Since 6th March 2009. DF FA Since 15th March 2009. Ex-Member Of WG Since 26th March 2009. Member of DF Since 6th April 2009. Clan Friend of WG Since 4th June 2009. --- ||Ex-WG Warlord || Current Member of DF || Ex-Rampage Leader || | ||||||||
Posted: October 15, 2008 04:20 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Group: Banned Posts: 2447 Member No.: 114 Joined: January 8, 2008 Total Events Attended: 149 | I apologize for ever thinking that any warring PRACTICE would take longer than 1 hr. I apologize for thinking that any event would take longer than 1 hr, as I try to keep mine short and fun. As it is, I probably won't attend another fighting practice event because it is much longer than I previously ever thought it could be. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: October 15, 2008 04:49 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Owennnn Group: Emeritus Posts: 1447 Member No.: 37 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 55 |
Maybe people should start putting estimated ending times on their event topics then? You also said the PKRI was unplanned, and was not a planned part of the event, I would bet heavily on your war training ending long before the PKRI actually ended. Tabs, you maybe should have PMed Mugger to remind him of your event, so he can either call off the PKRI, or at least let people that want to attend the skills event know that the event is starting now. When in the middle of a run-in, the last thing people are checking is the IRC, there needs to be an in Runescape notification system so that people attending one event, if it overlaps, can be told that the new event is starting, and should not be punished for leaving, especially if the first event is overruning randomly, and was not planned to last as long as it did. If sign-ups were involved in the 2nd, planned event, that should also be taken into consideration. I don't think this is a Skiller vs Warrer topic, it is a Planned Event Overruning vs Planned Event Starting topic. It could easily have happened to 2 skills based events, the first event could overrun unintentionally, in which case, the leaders of each event should let everyone know there is a clash, and if people want to leave to go to the other event, they can do, WITHOUT FEAR OF REPRIMAND. The problem here, is a lack of communication between Event leaders, and some unforeseen circumstances that caused a clash. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: October 15, 2008 04:58 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Cam Group: Ex-Member Posts: 749 Member No.: 24 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 69 | I say we get Tabs and Mugger to hug and kiss it all better   --------------------  Halo 3 - General Grade 3 ~ CoD4 - 10th Prestige 55 ~ MW2 - 9th Prestige 50 Joined WG 8th August 2006 - Im old School son | ||||||||
Posted: October 15, 2008 05:58 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 7306 Member No.: 47 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 343 |
The people who taking all the flak are people like me so that doesn't really seem fair since there was no punishment for leaving and even Mugger left. -------------------- July 5, 2007 - June 27, 2011 | ||||||||
Posted: October 15, 2008 07:16 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Trolls trolling trolls trolling trolls Group: Banned Posts: 2956 Member No.: 422 Joined: April 4, 2008 Total Events Attended: 130 |
Indeed, Nobody was (or would be) punished for leaving... lol -------------------- Mugger84 Member Of WG Since 4th April 2008. WG Raid Leader Since 20th June 2008. WG Council Since 20th November 2008. Banned from WG Since 6th March 2009. DF IG Since 6th March 2009. DF FA Since 15th March 2009. Ex-Member Of WG Since 26th March 2009. Member of DF Since 6th April 2009. Clan Friend of WG Since 4th June 2009. --- ||Ex-WG Warlord || Current Member of DF || Ex-Rampage Leader || | ||||||||
Random PKRI > Planned Skill Event