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These forums were used by WG from 2008 to 2011, and now exist for historical and achival purposes only. For the clan's current forums, CLICK HERE. |
"You are a Wilderness Guardian. That northern wasteland; that land of blood, desolation and death is your dominion. Tonight we are going home." ~His Lordship |
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Posted: September 29, 2008 11:32 am  | |||||||||
      IRC Nickname: Tnuac Group: Emeritus Posts: 1806 Member No.: 51 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 58    | Now maths is talking sense, he understands the situation from both sides. Just one thing - why such the huge opposition to sectors? People referr to them like the black death. I don't see the harm in doing what TBE does and make a 'warring list'. Not necessarily used for the proper full outs (every 2 weeks maybe), but for PKRI and miniwars with short preps. It seems like the PERFECT way to get round this. No need to change forum ranks, no need to divide the clan. We already have an 'emeritus' sector, is that hurting anybody? Of course not. I haven't heard one reason why we shouldn't make a warring list. Its the next best possibility. Is it because we're afraid of change? Because without attempting things, you don't know whether they'll work or not. -------------------- ~Aetas: carpe diem quam minimum credula postero~ "Seize the day and place no trust in tomorrow"  | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 11:39 am | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Dnovelta Group: Emeritus Posts: 2750 Member No.: 130 Joined: January 20, 2008 Total Events Attended: 137 |
Brilliant! I love how you're able to admit you're one of the war hungry people, but you can see what the less war inclined are going through. Personally, In terms of amount of wars we have, I'd say 1-2 full-outs a month, and that a sprinkle of optional PKRI's on the weekends. I just don't think forcing anyone who's online to go to an unscheduled event is something that should be done. Sure it'd be better for the clan, but I mean, so would intense practice sessions that we'd have as often as possible with strict rules and such. Just to make a real world connection that is obviously not on the same scale, but the idea is the same, think of the current war going on between the USA and Iraq/Iran/Afghanistan. Are all the American men just running to enlist? No. Would it be better for the military to have a larger suppl of troops should they need to send more men over there? Yes. Should we start forcing people to go against their will? No, we did that, it was the draft. We haven't done it again. Are those not running to enlist any less American? No. Are they any less patriotic? No. Sorry if anyone was offended by that comparison, but it was the only thing I could think of. We should come to a compromise, not implement Rob's idea of "do or die". Already all the other less war hungry people attend the Full-Out wars we have, and that's something. We should maybe require one planned PKRI, but leave the short prep PKRI's optional. The short prep ones can really piss people off because they may have planned to get a 99, or finish a quest in that time, and now they've got to go fight. Just think about when you've got a great weekend planned, then all of a sudden your parents say you've got to babysit because they're going somewhere, or the family is going somewhere together. You get angry because now you've got to do something totally unplanned and your schedule is ruined. Obviously not entirely the same because some of us can't just leave our family, but in RS you can just log out or not go. Again, the idea is the same. Do you really want people feeling angry like that a lot of the time? --------------------   | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 12:46 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rick Hamm Group: Ex-Member Posts: 573 Member No.: 1214 Joined: July 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 6 |
Okay, see ya. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 02:23 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Dilz Group: Banned Posts: 1403 Member No.: 973 Joined: June 23, 2008 Total Events Attended: 151 |
Wow Rob...just wow. ;| I joined this clan because Mugger told me the community is great and would help me back in to RS. I attend the wars because I enjoy fighting, reminds me of old wildy, but drivig people out who dont want to war is a big NO NO. If they dont want to war, then let them skill... Make a warring list, and if a skiller wants to attend the war, then frankly let them --------------------  LOLPNS  Perm banned. | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 04:12 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Trolls trolling trolls trolling trolls Group: Banned Posts: 2956 Member No.: 422 Joined: April 4, 2008 Total Events Attended: 130 |
Rob, I like you and all, but this post is a bit too extreme :S I disagree pretty strongly >.< This is not just a warring clan, and even if it at first was meant to be so, it certainly isn't purely one now. The community in WG is a pretty great one, and is also a factor of why people join, not to mention some people's love for skilling :$ ~Mugger84 EDIT: The big goon apologised   http://www.wildernessguardians.com/forum/i...?showtopic=6293 -------------------- Mugger84 Member Of WG Since 4th April 2008. WG Raid Leader Since 20th June 2008. WG Council Since 20th November 2008. Banned from WG Since 6th March 2009. DF IG Since 6th March 2009. DF FA Since 15th March 2009. Ex-Member Of WG Since 26th March 2009. Member of DF Since 6th April 2009. Clan Friend of WG Since 4th June 2009. --- ||Ex-WG Warlord || Current Member of DF || Ex-Rampage Leader ||  | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 05:35 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rick Hamm Group: Ex-Member Posts: 573 Member No.: 1214 Joined: July 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 6 | Is it enough or is it too late? I guess only time, and Rob's overall attitude towards skillers, will tell. I hope he's learned.  -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 06:10 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Cory|Melchior Group: Ex-Member Posts: 240 Member No.: 527 Joined: April 25, 2008 Total Events Attended: 5 | There has to be a division. You cannot say we are not a community or we are not a skiller clan, when half of the members here joined for SKILLING. Tabs, Rachel, me, and many others all have the same views. We didn't like pk'ing when it was profitable, why would we like it now when it's not. Also, in my absence, I have no fricken idea what these terms are, let alone the fact that I cannot learn them simply because all of these warring events are on weekends when I cannot attend them. If you want attendance, we need more people so we can have wars with gmt times and est times, but still allow any timezone to join in. To get more members, we actually have to show that we ARE a community, and we AREN'T war warmongers. If we were, we'd have no problem here. We aren't some of us have been skillers since we joined rs, some of us have been pk'ers, and a few are both. Most of us pay monthly to play the game on members, and then there is the expectation to attend every war event. We're paying for something that we don't find fun? No, it's blasphemy. If you want wars to turn out well, make sectors again. If you don't like the idea of sectors, figure out another solution. Forcing members to wars is an unacceptable solution. We don't force members to skilling events, why? No, I'm not saying we should, but if you're going to hold wars up on a pedestal, then you might as well do it for every thing. We don't need to be number one rank in anything. It's a damn game. We have each other, we are Wilderness Guardians. Every rant or flame is breaking the structure down. We don't need people leaving right now, especially if it's unnecessary. Some members leave basically because they don't like wg, and haven't from the moment they got here... BUT, some members are leaving who have been here for years, and love wg, but it's being ruined by rants and issues that don't get solved. Solve it damnit. I'm sick of this stuff happening, any clan I've ever gone through, it's the same shit. We're a community, we are skillers, and we are pk'ers. Some people simple want to devote more time in other areas, or just in a single area altogether. Regardless of what they do, they benefit the clan. To hell with being number one. We've been there, we're on the record book, drop it already. -------------------- Kingdom of Edgeville  | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 07:47 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Tnuac Group: Emeritus Posts: 1806 Member No.: 51 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 58 | Ikahigurashi is another of us who's pointing out the blaringly obvious problem, and the seemingly only possible solution. Where's the council? Its like we're having a office meeting and the manager is prancing around the room pretending the floor is made of snakes, not paying any attention at all. No doubt this issue will just get blown off when people stop complaining, as if its all ok and ignoring it will make it go away. I mean just look at the whole topic - the only council response is one person who made the most controversial post about the whole issue. I'm not trying to be a pain in the ass here but we have 3 pages of posts, some very insightful, and not 1 post (except the one i've mentioned) has come from council.. -------------------- ~Aetas: carpe diem quam minimum credula postero~ "Seize the day and place no trust in tomorrow" | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 07:54 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Group: Guests Posts: Member No.: 0 Joined: January 1, 1970 Total Events Attended: 1 |
not al clans are driven by waring there are plenty of non waring clans out there like hels hilts and many more i wasnt there but i knew it was upcoming my good reason = sleep when i heard about it it was 40 mins til the pkri i had to work at 4 o clock the next morning i could have made it but id be half death at work i cant have the risk to hit some one while ir on my truck its not like i have a ofice job since im a girl -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 08:22 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Geofff Group: Clan Friend Posts: 1238 Member No.: 608 Joined: May 12, 2008 Total Events Attended: 96 | People nowadays join clans because of how good at warring they are. Why do DF have so many members and can pull 100 people to a war? Cause they are the top warring clan. It creates a snowball effect which brings in even more members. For us to even start that sort of accomplishment we have to start bringing everyone possible to wars. You don't see Top Community lists or which clan is the best at skilling. Warring is the new fashion and we have to keep up with it. --------------------  | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 08:24 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rick Hamm Group: Ex-Member Posts: 573 Member No.: 1214 Joined: July 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 6 | So why do we have to be like everyone else? It's kind of selfish to think that we skillers should conform to YOUR way of playing the game. Why don't you join the skillers of the clan and not worry about wars? -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 08:30 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Tnuac Group: Emeritus Posts: 1806 Member No.: 51 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 58 |
No, no, no. You're missing the point completely. 1) Who cares about a list? We're not one of a tournament, we are a clan in our own right. Even then, PKRI's and wars do not affect the lists!. The real list only changes in full wars, which everyone is included in, and most people don't miss. 2) Fashion?! That's a joke. If we're bending over backwards to conform to fashion we might as well fold the clan now. If all we did was following fashion we would have died a long time ago. If we're going to try to copy everyone else, why don't we just merge into them? We're unique for a reason. This mentality really goes a-loss on me, and I can safely say I can see the whole picture. We're not DF's junior clan. -------------------- ~Aetas: carpe diem quam minimum credula postero~ "Seize the day and place no trust in tomorrow" | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 08:33 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: [JC] Group: Emeritus Posts: 3320 Member No.: 23 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 147 |
Dont worry Mike, I have been watching. However I have avoided posting up untill now as I feel that I am not nessacarily the best one to say what we should do in this position. I am, and have always been a skiller so I do not nessacarily have the same feelings on this issue as the rest of the council do. Sas much as I would love to say 'Lets bring back the sectors' I really dont think that is the solution to our current issues, if you recall how it was during the sectors we had huge issues with a tiny amount of people that would attend wilderness events, while a huge amount of people stuck around attending one event a week as a skiller. By dividing the clan up into sectors again I feel that we would risk creating even bigger divides between those who want to skill and those who want to war.... Anyone recall the person that said "skillers are selfish?" I feel that sentiments such as that would become more prevalent if we divide back into sectors once again, as skilling is protrayed as the easy way to retain membership in WG (not saying that it is) and I really feel that this would be unavoidable. I really dont think sectors will work. ~Evil --------------------  Old awards wat Most Mature & Most Honourable Most Dedicated|IRC Freak|Best Emeritus Placeholder lolz | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 08:43 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Tnuac Group: Emeritus Posts: 1806 Member No.: 51 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 58 |
Thanks for posting evil. Again as I've said before, it doesn't matter how detailed a post is, or how accurate. Just as long as people know its being thought about, with a quick brief post, it can instill a lot of confidence. Not everything has to be perfectly composed. As long as something is from the heart, and obviously not too confrontational, it can still make a world of difference. And as to you, evil (even thought I'm PMing you right at this minute, lol), because you are a skiller council your input is extremely valuable, and could save the clan. People need to listen to you, because you are the representitive of the skilling side. As for sectors - I did consider it at a fleeting moment, but soon figured its too extreme. Its an old way we don't need to revert to. I do however believe that a memberlist for a PKri/miniwar group would be the best, and possibly the only solution to this conflict, and I'm not the only person who's thought it. It shouldn't divide the clan at all, and would make it so much easier. -------------------- ~Aetas: carpe diem quam minimum credula postero~ "Seize the day and place no trust in tomorrow" | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 08:55 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Hyperion Group: Ex-Member Posts: 1636 Member No.: 978 Joined: June 23, 2008 Total Events Attended: 141 |
I'd have to be out. --------------------    Dragon boots:29 Whips:2 | ||||||||
Posted: September 29, 2008 10:43 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Jenny Group: Emeritus Posts: 1967 Member No.: 19 Joined: December 29, 2007 Total Events Attended: 56 | Bringing back the sectors would be a big mistake imo. That would lead to more isolationism than we have now. Basically warring is how a clan gets it reputation, we have had good pking eras and bad ones. I think we are in a rebuilding phase and are recovering still from the wildy updates. As long as people are in the clan and online, where there is a need you should attend a warring event. This was not some 12 hour pkri, it lasted an hour. We have excellent raid leaders, but sometimes it seems not the best warring decisions are made. Just because you guys want a fight 24/7 doesn't mean everyone does. I think that you owe it to your clan to come fight if you can, but if you just can't do it then don't. Every event is important, however the reputation in the clan world is one based on warring not trawler trips. We need to find a way to blend all our needs to make a happy medium. The people who love to war certainly supported the recent Skill Olympics very admirably. We are in this together, there is no need to be at each others throats. The hand that holds the sword may also hold the harp. Not all days are full of strife, some are days of peace and fellowship. --------------------   | ||||||||
Posted: September 30, 2008 03:18 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Abs Group: Emeritus Posts: 2071 Member No.: 4 Joined: December 26, 2007 Total Events Attended: 97 | This is my opinion: Wg isn't a clan purely on just people who want to war or Skill, Whether you like it or not, it is a mixture of both. That's why we need to satisfy everyone's needs, we can't just kick all the Skillers or kick all the warrers so that we can satisfy one goal because there are friendship circles within circles. Which is why we won't force anyone to come to wars, we won't force anyone to come to Skilling Events. However you have to come to some kind of Event/War to prove your activity, Emeritus is expected to come to our most Important Wars. If you are asked to come to a War/Event, and you reply "No", then that is as far as it goes, you should not be questioned further or pressured into coming, if you're coming, it should be because you either want to help the clan bond and perform well or because you have fun or both. However for our most important wars, you should post saying why you aren't coming, we expect everyone to take part if they can to boost our clan's morale and to have us at a better position in the clan world. ~Abs --------------------  "I may not agree with what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it." Wg Council & Secondary Leader - 21/10/07 to 24/12/08 Msn: [email protected] | ||||||||
Posted: September 30, 2008 03:34 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rick Hamm Group: Ex-Member Posts: 573 Member No.: 1214 Joined: July 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 6 | I can live with that Abs. Nice and fair solution. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: September 30, 2008 06:05 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Cory|Melchior Group: Ex-Member Posts: 240 Member No.: 527 Joined: April 25, 2008 Total Events Attended: 5 |
Agreed. If people will accept a simple "no", then it's as simple as that. -------------------- Kingdom of Edgeville | ||||||||
Posted: September 30, 2008 07:59 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Zlat Group: Clan Friend Posts: 2781 Member No.: 9 Joined: December 29, 2007 Total Events Attended: 60 | Sup, this isnt DF, you cant force people to do something that they dont want. This is what all the community/skilled based people in this clan will say. Thats why we dont win any wars unless we fight clans like The Crusade .. --------------------   | ||||||||
Kidding me?, **** THAT
