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"You are a Wilderness Guardian. That northern wasteland; that land of blood, desolation and death is your dominion. Tonight we are going home." ~His Lordship |
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Posted: August 28, 2008 02:41 pm  | |||||||||
      IRC Nickname: Wayne|Eregion2 Group: Emeritus Posts: 3087 Member No.: 156 Joined: January 25, 2008 Total Events Attended: 8    | If I remember right I'm set to graduate in about a week; I've had horrible conflicts with events but I think I can work that out, although I was wondering if an extension might be possible since I'll be on vacation all this weekend and won't have internet access. I did have some other questions though:
What the heck are these? I've never EVER heard anything about them before.
I haven't taken screenshots of any attended events.  Help plx?  --------------------  | ||||||||
Posted: August 28, 2008 03:20 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Yingy Group: Clan Friend Posts: 2205 Member No.: 27 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 21 | Quote 1: Hybrid and Binding events Quote 2: Difficult to explain so maybe get a post/topic on how to upload images to the forums and post them. -------------------- Friend's Forver The Long Road Ahead - 91/99 Prayer   | ||||||||
Posted: August 28, 2008 03:40 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Wayne|Eregion2 Group: Emeritus Posts: 3087 Member No.: 156 Joined: January 25, 2008 Total Events Attended: 8 | I know how to upload images, but I don't have any to upload.  And I haven't heard about any biweekly hybrid/binding events, just random ones after we get trashed in a war and people are embarrassed enough to make one up. Where's a thread for them? -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: August 28, 2008 03:49 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Gorgemaster Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 9840 Member No.: 3 Joined: December 26, 2007 Total Events Attended: 540 | Wayne strikes an excellent point about the number of War Training events, we do have them but rarely twice a week. I think that should be lowered to one War Training Session to graduate, mm. As for not taking the screenshots, don't worry about it. The attendance pictures will prove that you have attended the events and should be sufficient for your app.  An extension will also probably be fine, just have a word with Abs or another council member  ~George  --------------------    | ||||||||
Posted: August 28, 2008 04:54 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Baconman81 Group: Clan Friend Posts: 244 Member No.: 1267 Joined: August 8, 2008 Total Events Attended: 13 | Try to remember the events you attended and go to the topics in Events Recap and try to find a picture or a quote with you in it. -------------------- † Proud To Be Iraqi  And Christian † ||90/99 Woodcutting  || | ||||||||
Posted: August 28, 2008 08:11 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rick Hamm Group: Ex-Member Posts: 573 Member No.: 1214 Joined: July 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 6 | Okay, my question is: I'm not a war person, per se, I mean I will go if I have to, but I don't need a special training session to know my role in a war. I've been doing wars for WG for, well, longer than most people have been here. I think that's a hogwash assignment in order to graduate and I hope it gets fixed soon. As for the events, I'll try making some as long as they're not last minute "lets go BH" events. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: August 28, 2008 08:36 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Owennnn Group: Emeritus Posts: 1447 Member No.: 37 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 55 |
Yes, but how many wars have you been to recently? Do you understand the clan wars arena? Do you know the boundaries and their names? I think war training is a good idea, if that's what it is, war training, just standing binding clanmates is not war training. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: August 28, 2008 08:53 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rick Hamm Group: Ex-Member Posts: 573 Member No.: 1214 Joined: July 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 6 |
Personally Owen, I could care less. When have I ever been the kind of person to conform? Gene is already aware of my "warring" experience and if I can't go with what I did before, you may as well dismiss me now because I'll never make it to regular Guardian. Wars are meant to be fun and to me, fun is what I make it. I don't need to know how to do anything but show up. What I do after that is my business and what I call fun. I'm not in this to win, if you are then you have your priorities a little messed up. I play for enjoyment, not rankings or bragging rights. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: August 28, 2008 09:02 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Wayne|Eregion2 Group: Emeritus Posts: 3087 Member No.: 156 Joined: January 25, 2008 Total Events Attended: 8 | I dislike warring as well, seems a bit dumb. I only put up with it to hang out with you guys.  PS: Exceptions would be single-combat wars, which I'd love, but they were never popular. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: August 28, 2008 10:33 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Owennnn Group: Emeritus Posts: 1447 Member No.: 37 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 55 |
That's fair enough Rick, I also know your warring/raiding experience. All I'm trying to do is make a point for attending the war training. I used to be a Raid Leader, however I'm still expected to attend these events. On the flip side, you could say that WG is supposedly a clan for people who just want to skill, or have fun, making mandatory war training sessions for someone who is only here for skills events is asking a bit much. Anyway, leave me alone, I'm new -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: August 28, 2008 11:01 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Mike|Sonix Group: Ex-Member Posts: 1483 Member No.: 13 Joined: December 29, 2007 Total Events Attended: 103 | Owen does bring up a good point. As far as I can tell, WG is still a skilling clan, alongside warring. And more than being the best, we are here for the community (at least I hope so). Thats always the way I looked at WG. Unfortunately during the CWPL, we became far to war-focused and didn't seem to care about the community at all. We have improved since then. Its obvious that we should stay away from serious warring. Anyways, Baconman makes a good point. Just look back on some event recaps, the attendance pic should be enough. Whoever has the balls to decline you for not having a war practice screenie should be castrated. A) Because your Wayne,  We hardly have any of them, anyways. --------------------   | ||||||||
Posted: August 29, 2008 09:36 am | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: rachellove Group: Council Posts: 6955 Member No.: 173 Joined: January 31, 2008 Total Events Attended: 305 | If I would of had to have all that stuff when I joined, I would of never made it in. Steve had to teach me about screenies and stuff. LOL As far as war goes, I didn't realize what clan wars were when I joined WG. I never had done any kind of p vs p stuff before other than for fun at the arena with my friends. I'm still very skill related. My combat percentage is around 24%. Does anyone think that this makes me a bad WG guardian? I hope not cause I love the clan. For me it's about all my friends and family here. <333 In my opinion, we need to keep focus on the fact that WG is not just about winning at wars. --------------------  Thank you Garrett and Dallar. “The day soldiers stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them. They have either lost confidence that you can help them or concluded that you do not care. Either case is a failure of leadership.” ~~Colin Powell ~~  | ||||||||
Posted: August 29, 2008 09:57 am | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Abs Group: Emeritus Posts: 2071 Member No.: 4 Joined: December 26, 2007 Total Events Attended: 97 |
But Rick..As Owen pointed out, Runescape has changed since 2-3 Years ago in the form of warring, the old wilderness is gone, Bounty Hunter is replaced with it, Clan Wars as well and Clan Wars is what we do most. That means you should know about how to tank around the new four walls, how to hybrid, how to snipe, how to antisnipe. This is the new style of warring and all of the old warring experience is wiped out. Consider it like Post count when you switch forums, it gets reset and you start again. Anyway I've reduced the Training Sessions to one since Raid Leaders haven't been hosting much of them, if you've been to like 3 wars and post screenshots of those then an exception can probably be made. Wayne, as someone has said before, check Event Recaps, a screenshot is usually posted there. ~Abs --------------------  "I may not agree with what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it." Wg Council & Secondary Leader - 21/10/07 to 24/12/08 Msn: [email protected] | ||||||||
Posted: August 29, 2008 10:29 am | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Wayne|Eregion2 Group: Emeritus Posts: 3087 Member No.: 156 Joined: January 25, 2008 Total Events Attended: 8 | Thanks. Just made it to a war training event completely by accident, lol. It's good to go just to get used to the CW arena and see how it's laid out. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: August 29, 2008 12:17 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rick Hamm Group: Ex-Member Posts: 573 Member No.: 1214 Joined: July 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 6 | But what if I have no interest in warring at all? What if I don't like the new way with Clan Wars? Personally, it's a huge waste of my time to chase someone around a fucking wall for 3 hours. That's all CW is. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: August 29, 2008 07:45 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Karlfischer Group: Ex-Member Posts: 664 Member No.: 124 Joined: January 12, 2008 Total Events Attended: 55 |
I do not think it is asking too much to have skillers attend one war training event. Skillers have as much right to attend wars as any other members, however in return we ask that they (and every other new member) atleast have a basic knowledge of what to do during a war should they want to attend one. It would be a completely different story if we forced them to come to wars, but rather we are giving them that choice to make for themselves. If we are going to give every clan member the freedom to come to wars as they wish, we also need to ensure that every member knows how to behave properly at wars. I acknowledge Rick's point about having fun in the game--wars should be about fun. However, not following orders and basic etiquette of warring ruins the game for your clan mates. Knowing the basics of what to do in a war does not prevent you from having fun in the war. On the contrary, many new members do not have fun at wars because they feel lost and rejected when other members scold them for doing something wrong. When we war it is expected that everyone present has a basic knowledge of warring, and it is not fair to our new members to throw them into war without first teaching them this basic knowledge. Nor is it fair to put some members through war training and not others, only to let those who did not go through training change their minds and decide to attend wars anyways. Even if people say they are not going to attend wars, we have no clue who is going to change their mind, which is why everyone needs to do it. --------------------   | ||||||||
Posted: August 29, 2008 08:45 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Mistah_Vince Group: Ex-Member Posts: 2235 Member No.: 233 Joined: February 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 85 |
3 hours is way too long. Wars last an hour tops.  --------------------   | ||||||||
Posted: August 29, 2008 10:18 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rick Hamm Group: Ex-Member Posts: 573 Member No.: 1214 Joined: July 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 6 | Even still. An hour chasing someone around a wall is hardly my idea of fun. I think Karl said it best. With the new PvP coming out, CW is probably going to be a thing of the past anyway. Who knows what the new rules are going to be and what happens if it's totally different? Then everyone will have to go through some extensive training program for that? Jagex leaves unlimited possibilities...they come out with one thing, leave it for a while and make something better. Take for example...Castle Wars. That was THE thing to do in RS when it first came out. Now look at it. The same thing is going to be said about CW when this new PvP comes out. It will hardly be used. Karl, you said that wars aren't mandatory, then why is training for it? Just in case I want to attend one? If we're skillers, why should we be MADE to attend war training? If I decide to ever go to a war, I'll be sure and attend a training session, however, I don't think it should be a requirement. Having people train for something that they'll never use is hardly worth the time or the effort. Everything I've ever learned about combat in the service, I can use. Granted, I didn't have a choice or say in the matter whether I wanted to train hand to hand, grenade, rifle or whatever, but that's real life and it's no fun (well, sometimes it's fun when you're handing someone their guts or making them eat their own blood) but again, that's survival. This is a game and meant for fun. Fun, to me, is not warring your way, but mine. The way I warred was fun for everyone whether we won or lost. I don't want to know how to hybrid because I'll never use it. I don't want to know how to tank because I don't care to and again, it's something that I won't use. That's pretty much all I'm saying. If I change my mind about wars, I'll attend the training, but I'm not going to give up what little time I have to play the game, going to something I'm never going to use right now. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: August 29, 2008 11:11 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Karlfischer Group: Ex-Member Posts: 664 Member No.: 124 Joined: January 12, 2008 Total Events Attended: 55 |
I tried to explain why skillers need the war training as best I could last post...and you did not really challenge my answer to the question, you just repeated the question. Rather than repeat myself, ill try to explain it a different way. First of all, you should know that as far as I am concerned this debate is not really about you. I would be glad for you to bypass the mandatory training if not for the repercussions that would result from giving you an exception. I know I am not going to convince you of my point, but rather I am trying to convince others that there is a valid reason for maintaining the mandatory practices. Even though I hold you true to your word that you will not attend wars if you do not attend the practice event, the real problem is the results of granting you an exception, which I will try to explain as best I can: My first concern is of course for fairness. All trial members need to be held to the same standards, and we cannot allow some trial members to have it easier than others, regardless of if they are experienced in warring or old school. Allowing the kind of exception that Rick wants leads to favoritism and resentment. If we allow Rick an exception but do not grant it to others, that is blatant favoritism that goes contrary to our morals. We cannot justify giving Rick an exception without giving others the same exception. Very well, but now we have guardians in the clan who are allowed to attend wars, but do not really have a clue what they are doing. We could of course solve this delema by granting the exception under the condition that Rick not attend wars, but that leads to a vast new problem in that we basically create a new new rank of guardian: those not allowed to attend wars. The freedom to attend wars is inherent in the guardian rank, and to take that away belittles the rank and damages the community by creating a division. This should not be a new concept to you Rick: even cooks have to go through basic. Finally, I think these war training events serve more than just training people how to fight. They are in part tests of character for our new members, who we generally know very little about. In particular it test their temperament; if they are willing to listen to leaders, get along with other members, and not flame after the fight. Even if some members are not going to attend any wars, this is still a good way to spot members with poor attitudes or who simply do not belong in WG. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: August 30, 2008 12:09 am | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rick Hamm Group: Ex-Member Posts: 573 Member No.: 1214 Joined: July 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 6 | You know what. This isn't worth it. It don't matter what I have to say, Karl is going to try and dissect every little aspect to make me sound like I'm wanting favoritism. He's done it in other posts and he's doing it here...again. I NEVER ASKED FOR FAVORITISM OR AN EXCEPTION FOR ME!!!!!!! Karl, your whole stupid post was nothing more than your attempt to piss me off, which you again, have succeeded in doing. You focused on ONE thing and it was your perception that I was only doing this for myself. If skillers wanted to attend a war, they wouldn't be skillers, now would they? I don't see what the big yank is with people that don't like to war. Is WG still stuck in the "I'm better than you and can kick your ass in a war" mode? I mean, for some, it's great and that's what THEY enjoy. I don't give them any grief, do I? As long as they're having fun doing what THEY want to do, it's all good. So why is it that you give ME a hard time for something that I find fun and that's not warring? Is it because it's in direct conflict with what YOU find as a good time? And please don't try to talk to me about the inner workings of the military unless you've been there and have been through it. You know nothing but what you read about and majority of that is bullshit. Reread my first post again...I believe I said something along the lines of...I think that's a hogwash assignment in order to graduate and I hope it gets fixed soon. I merely asked that the requirements change or get fixed, not for me alone, but for those LIKE me who may wish to become a part of the Wilderness Guardians, but get turned off because of something they don't believe in, don't want to do or find rather boring. What's the harm in that? Why make a new rank for those not allowed to war? Why aren't we allowed? If you read my posts Karl, you'd understand that I said that should I decide I'd like to help out in a war, I'd be more than happy to go to a training session. My problem is going to this training session as a part of a graduation from Trial to Regular Guardian. If you want to dismiss me because I have a "poor attitude" or because I question authority...then fine...do it, but if you're going to dismiss me because I don't want to partake in something that can't hold my attention for 2 seconds, then there's an issue. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: August 30, 2008 02:38 am | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Wayne|Eregion2 Group: Emeritus Posts: 3087 Member No.: 156 Joined: January 25, 2008 Total Events Attended: 8 | I kind of consider warring a clan's membership fee; they're comparatively rare and not mandatory, so helping out is up to you. I think it's a good idea to have a war training session required just to show that, even though this is really fun and games, you're taking the responsibility of joining a clan and occasionally your friends might need you to help out with something that you don't particularly find enticing. And they last like 10 minutes, lol. Just my 1/50th of a dollar.  PS: We should have biweekly FoG events though; either that or quit complaining about all the clan members who don't have the gear. Plus F2p FoG is great warring practice in itself when it comes to tanking and binds, so we could be killing two birds with one stone. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: August 30, 2008 03:16 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: rachellove Group: Council Posts: 6955 Member No.: 173 Joined: January 31, 2008 Total Events Attended: 305 | lol I'd be riding the failboat in WG if I could only give my help at wars. Sorry guys I'm a community person or skiller myself. I appreciate that my lame attempts at war are kept to few. But still I don't mind on occassion coming to practice or war stuff. Mostly cause I hang out with some of the clan I would never see at fishing or wc. Just the same I have to agree about War practice for graduation. Do any of you really think I would have joined and stayed if I would of had to do that. I would have been so intimidated to even try war stuff. Before WG I never even thought about war or pk or bh. If the clan is all about war then keep your requirements and your turning away possible future members like me. Love you guys either way, but just think about it from my point of view. <333 If I would for some reason have to leave the clan would I be able to qualify to get back in??? Interesting thought. I guess my one chance to be a member is the one I have right now.  -------------------- Thank you Garrett and Dallar. “The day soldiers stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them. They have either lost confidence that you can help them or concluded that you do not care. Either case is a failure of leadership.” ~~Colin Powell ~~ | ||||||||
Posted: August 30, 2008 03:21 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Yingy Group: Clan Friend Posts: 2205 Member No.: 27 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 21 |
Your not the only one who feels this way, i'm in the same boat as you. I dislike wars as i am more a community/skiller person, The point you bring up about quality is a very good point and should be addressed. Things were run differently and this clan turned into a warring clan more than a skiller/community clan (Once the sectors were removed). Im not saying that we are all about warring because we still have aspects of the other stuff, just not as much. Will those who are more skiller/community have a future in this clan if they leave and want to rejoin in the future? -------------------- Friend's Forver The Long Road Ahead - 91/99 Prayer | ||||||||
Posted: August 30, 2008 03:26 pm | |||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rick Hamm Group: Ex-Member Posts: 573 Member No.: 1214 Joined: July 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 6 | And that post right there Rachel is why I love you so much. And Simon, that's what it's seeming to me. If you leave and return, you have to start over from the beginning, no matter what you did before. If the reqs change, you must adhere or be shunned. -------------------- | ||||||||
Posted: August 30, 2008 07:03 pm | |||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Matt|Multi Group: Emeritus Posts: 668 Member No.: 49 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 12 | As someone who's comming back (Yeah, I said it) i'm voicing my opinion. I'm siding with Rick. Warring used to be fun, back when it was actually a war. BD and DoA were the most fun things i've ever done in RS. Now, warring has devolved to as Rick said "Chasing someone around a fucking wall for 3 hours". I have no interest to participate in this new area of combat, but if for some strange reason I did, I would take it upon myself to attend a training session. Why not simply impliment a requirement that you have attended a training session before you are allowed to war, instead of making it required for graduation? -------------------- Born at sea, baptized in blood your fame will never die. Your Division is one of the best if not the best division in the history of American arms -Gen George S Patton on the 45th Infantry Division  | ||||||||
Graduation IssuesPages: (2) [1] 2