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"You are a Wilderness Guardian. That northern wasteland; that land of blood, desolation and death is your dominion. Tonight we are going home." ~His Lordship |
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Posted: December 28, 2008 04:06 am  | |||||
      IRC Nickname: Brian|30 Group: Ex-Member Posts: 565 Member No.: 1547 Joined: December 13, 2008 Total Events Attended: 75    | I will describe you guys my experience with getting into Wilderness Guardians (not that I'm not even a member yet). Long Version I decided I wanted to play RS again around December 10th, after around 2 years of retirement. I recovered 30 Str 0wnz from the person that took it (another story) and started paying for membership. After a few days of playing I decided that it would be a lot more fun with my old clan, The Wilderness Guardians. I had already added some former WG'ers and was talking to them, and I jumped on the site and registered. I made my introduction and everything was going swimmingly. After hanging out with WG as an intro and going to a war as an FA I made my application and became a Trial Guardian. Yay. Then the terror that was and is the trial guardian period began. I tried my best to attend 5 events and a war preparation and did it really fast. I was trying to be the model WG'er and was extremely active. I made my topic and tried to find 5 supporters. That was hell cause I couldn't find anyone that would actually support. People said I'd be a great addition to the clan but wouldn't physically say they supported. I tried the IRC and was stopped. I had to ask personally. I finally found 5 supporters. Yay. All I needed now was my mentor, Omar to accept and I'd finally be a guardian. Surprise  he said I wasn't ready. Then he goes on vacation and leaves me unable to respond to his rejection. After waiting for what seemed like forever, he finally got on and accepted me. Yay. BUT WAIT. Apparently the supporters didn't expand on why they support me (which wasn't explained in the guide to apply topic btw). So now I'm waiting for everyone to log on, some that are on a different timezone then me, making sure I talk to them PERSONALLY and hoping they'll be able to expand on why they support me. No wonder WG isn't getting a whole bunch of recruits.Short Version
Now this whole process took ages for me. Remember that I've been as active as can be and yet this is how long it takes for me to graduate? There is no way that a spy is going to join WG. There are plenty of other ways to find out about wars. (For example: A close WG friend, low levels scouting, joining an active cc, bribing members) All this would take a quarter of the time it takes to pass through to guardian even being the most active you can be. I was formerly in WG and it did not take this long, so unless you're a recently joined recruit you cannot say it took me two days. I believe that if we ever want the ratio of joins/leaves favor the joins, we need to shorten the application process. It's not like we're the heavy targeted clan like we used to be so there aren't going to be as many people wanting to crash our events like there used to. Just needed to say something  [/RANT]  -------------------- Dragon Claws Drops: 1 2 Dragonic Visage Drops: 1 Ruined Dragon Drops: 1 Abyssal Whip Drops: 1 2 | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 04:12 am | |||||
 IRC Nickname: Lefty Group: Emeritus Posts: 3340 Member No.: 1055 Joined: June 30, 2008 Total Events Attended: 211 | The application process and graduation process is to weed out the inactive. The requirements that they ask you to do, such as the referral or the recommendations are only for you to try to get out and get to know the people that are in WG instead of just asking random people "Can you recommend me to graduate?". There is a purpose, it has just been abused recently. If someone really knows you to the extent that it isintended to be, then the extent of their referrals should not be the problem. Another reason for the mentor system. ALSO, if you seem to be active and trying your hardest to make the graduation, then I would say 9 times out of 10 your graduation period will be extended. --------------------      | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 04:28 am | |||||
| IRC Nickname: Brian|30 Group: Ex-Member Posts: 565 Member No.: 1547 Joined: December 13, 2008 Total Events Attended: 75 |
Is that really fair to the people that want to be a WG member so far as to spend a good portion of their life to be a good applicant? I don't think its worth it so you can weed out that one RoT member that appears once in a million years. Many know me well enough that they'd be happy to support me and explain why. The thing that ticked me off is that WG has these hidden, unwritten rules that are only mentioned when someone breaks them. For instance, the whole "expand on why you support" thing. I just think that a WG member should spend more time being a member then a trial and that's why many people don't make it past the trial stage. Sure we may create quality through this system, but quality sits in the shade of quantity when there are only 80 qualified people. -------------------- Dragon Claws Drops: 1 2 Dragonic Visage Drops: 1 Ruined Dragon Drops: 1 Abyssal Whip Drops: 1 2 | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 04:51 am | |||||
 IRC Nickname: Ret[Keith] Group: Emeritus Posts: 2049 Member No.: 86 Joined: January 1, 2008 Total Events Attended: 82 | On the upside, those people can now log on and see this topic, ane elaborate. -------------------- Best Firemaker in WG no lie   <--- rofl1st joined WG: October 18th, 2005. Ex-WG mod, OPH winner  ^My original idea (U GOIN DOWN TWIZ)^ 189th person to get "100" firemaking Hash Unit, Tun Unit, C-Unit    | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 04:55 am | |||||
| IRC Nickname: Lefty Group: Emeritus Posts: 3340 Member No.: 1055 Joined: June 30, 2008 Total Events Attended: 211 | If you say that it is to weed out the one RoT member, then you are wrong. The step from trial to full member only opens up one forum where not much happens honestly. The trial step is to weed out the inactive, and keeps the ones that may be inactive from joining the ranks of WG.
Honestly is 1 month that much of your life? 1 month is 1/12 of a year, and many can graduate earlier than that month. Also most of us are 13+ so that is what? At most 1/156 of our life in which we are playing a video game anyways? One month as a trial is not going to hurt. For many people it may take two weeks to apply for graduation, and for you information there have been threads that have asked for us to start expanding on our referrals. I am REALLY glad to see that someone said that you couldn't graduate because you were given a half ass referral. If you can't make it past the trial stage, then what are you to the clan? Someone that fails to be active in a clan for a month? Someone that does not really want to be in a clan that is famous throughout much of the clan world? WG has a reputation and it should be a complete honor to be accepted as a full member of WG, so if it requires a lot of hard work, then so be it. At the end of the situation be proud that you made it that far and strive for the rank that is next. EDIT: What is a RoT member wanting to see? Our raid times? Any trial can easily see that post. So yes, that goes along with my first point/paragraph. -------------------- | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 05:11 am | |||||
| IRC Nickname: Brian|30 Group: Ex-Member Posts: 565 Member No.: 1547 Joined: December 13, 2008 Total Events Attended: 75 | The point isn't that I CAN'T or someone CAN'T make it through the application stage. It's that it takes too long to do so. No one wants to apply to a clan if they think they can't be a member of it after a month of heavy activity. Most people would say that WG had more of a reputation years ago then it does now. Why is that? Because we kept our mentality that the innocent should be protected from Pkers while still actively recruiting members because it appealed to them. Why aren't we getting the members and reputation that we used to? Because back then it was a privilege to be in WG yet it didn't take ages to get in. The only way we can build our reputation and be noted as a successful clan in RSC and in RS is if we have the members to fight the clans that stand for the exact opposite that we stand for. The exclusiveness that we have right now means nothing without the recognition from outside sources. The "successful clans" (top of the RAW list etc) seem to do well off, their members lose sets and sets of Rune yet the only thing extreme about their applications are the stat and activity requirements. Looking at our activity member list there are plenty of inactives (if you consider 12 days+ inactive). -------------------- Dragon Claws Drops: 1 2 Dragonic Visage Drops: 1 Ruined Dragon Drops: 1 Abyssal Whip Drops: 1 2 | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 05:18 am | |||||
 IRC Nickname: His Lordship Group: Founder Posts: 6029 Member No.: 1 Joined: December 26, 2007 Total Events Attended: 129 | I have just now simplified the process, making it easier for future members. I'm sorry that you had to go through all the hardships. --------------------  | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 05:28 am | |||||
| IRC Nickname: Lefty Group: Emeritus Posts: 3340 Member No.: 1055 Joined: June 30, 2008 Total Events Attended: 211 | There are two people who have 12+ days of inactivity on forums. Not plenty. It does not take that long to make it through the application stage. It is not a month of heavy activity. Basically 1 event a week. That is the asked requirement saying that you can see that within the events bar that is under your avatar. If you can't meet that to even graduate what makes you seem to be an active member? If done right and efficiently, you can easily make it from an intro to a regular guardian in under 3 weeks. How bad is that? -------------------- | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 05:29 am | |||||
 IRC Nickname: Tnuac Group: Emeritus Posts: 1806 Member No.: 51 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 58 | wooooo -------------------- ~Aetas: carpe diem quam minimum credula postero~ "Seize the day and place no trust in tomorrow"  | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 12:33 pm | |||||
 IRC Nickname: Abs Group: Emeritus Posts: 2071 Member No.: 4 Joined: December 26, 2007 Total Events Attended: 97 |
Mike lol, all your posts have been like "oooo" "omgggg" "weeee" "yayyy" You have been spamming so much XD ------- Anyway, yeah, just graduate him I say, he's obviously dedicated enough. ~Abs --------------------  "I may not agree with what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it." Wg Council & Secondary Leader - 21/10/07 to 24/12/08 Msn: [email protected] | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 12:54 pm | |||||
 IRC Nickname: Rage|Mike Group: Clan Friend Posts: 1948 Member No.: 1238 Joined: July 29, 2008 Total Events Attended: 132 | Actually our application/trial process is VERY short compared to the majority of decent clans. There are less members in the clan nowadays not because of our application process, but because of the 'slump' of the clan world. Clans such as TDM and DS used to have HUGE memberlists, now TDM is down to 130'ish members (Compared to their old 300, that's really low), and DS has closed down. We already have inactivity problems in the clan, sure we could fix them but it won't do us any good when we get inactive recruits. The current trial process is great, anyone who spends 2 hours on his PC can easily meet them. All what you have to do is get to know people while still attending events. Bear in mind that a 30 day month has 720 hours, spending 60 hours for WG (2 hours per day) and you're left with 660 hours. No one asked you to ignore IRL and focus entirely on WG, when you're only required to spend 8% of your time on WG. The other 92% is fully yours. Oh and tbh, you shouldn't spend more than 2 weeks on your trial process. It's fairly short, and hey, the only two differences between a trial guardian and a guardian is 1 boring forum which guardians can see, and being 'officially' a member of WG. That means even if you don't get accepted right away, just be patient, it's not going to be the end of the world l: Don't consider this as a flame, but I'm just stating what I feel on this. --------------------  MSN: [email protected] IRC: Rage|Mike at SwiftIRC and SeersIRC Drop me a comment, click to view my RSC profile! Proud to be ex-Wilderness Guardian.  | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 02:07 pm | |||||
 IRC Nickname: Geofff Group: Clan Friend Posts: 1238 Member No.: 608 Joined: May 12, 2008 Total Events Attended: 96 | We only want the most dedicated to join Wg. --------------------  | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 03:04 pm | |||||
| IRC Nickname: Tnuac Group: Emeritus Posts: 1806 Member No.: 51 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 58 |
The result of 6 pints, 4 JD cokes and a vodka coke. I think I've got rid of the majority of posts now. The process really does sound annoying, especially in your case. If a mentor goes on holiday someone else should step in, its not fair to leave someone hanging like that. It does seem slightly too complicated (although its still just as important not to have forum spies, and we have had many in the past), but it should at least be better explained and less confusing. -------------------- ~Aetas: carpe diem quam minimum credula postero~ "Seize the day and place no trust in tomorrow" | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 04:42 pm | |||||
 IRC Nickname: Pazenon Group: Emeritus Posts: 1477 Member No.: 33 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 79 | Dude, no offence but have some patience lol. You got accepted on the 14th or the 15th, and you applied for graduation on the 23rd; which is like 5-6 days before the day you should have done so. And coming from the time I've spent seeing WG graduation topics like yours, they rarely get accepted on the first couple of days (because of the errors and all that). -------------------- | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 05:14 pm | |||||
 IRC Nickname: Trolls trolling trolls trolling trolls Group: Banned Posts: 2956 Member No.: 422 Joined: April 4, 2008 Total Events Attended: 130 | In all fairness, the reason your Graduation took so long was because you posted a leaving topic during your trial. The Trial process is a month long, thus why we give one month for people to graduate  And your referrals not expanding on their referral is yes, no fault of your own, but a tiny problem at that  ~Mugger84 -------------------- Mugger84 Member Of WG Since 4th April 2008. WG Raid Leader Since 20th June 2008. WG Council Since 20th November 2008. Banned from WG Since 6th March 2009. DF IG Since 6th March 2009. DF FA Since 15th March 2009. Ex-Member Of WG Since 26th March 2009. Member of DF Since 6th April 2009. Clan Friend of WG Since 4th June 2009. --- ||Ex-WG Warlord || Current Member of DF || Ex-Rampage Leader ||  | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 05:40 pm | |||||
 IRC Nickname: [Narita] Group: Guest Posts: 695 Member No.: 1378 Joined: October 15, 2008 Total Events Attended: 34 | took me over a month, get over it -------------------- | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 07:49 pm | |||||
| IRC Nickname: Brian|30 Group: Ex-Member Posts: 565 Member No.: 1547 Joined: December 13, 2008 Total Events Attended: 75 | Although I'm not really in the mood for debating, the get over it comments kinda piss me off. I think people that try their hardest to be an extremely active member should be rewarded for it. It's not fair to just put everyone in the same category of one month because what gives people the motivation to be active if they know it'll take a month anyway. They might as well do their 5 events and just stop playing till one month. I'm not complaining for me because I'll get it after I get the supports, but I'm "complaining" if you could call it that for all the future applicants that will have to sit through the month that I did. I am also "complaining" for the sake of trying to make WG better, which most people don't understand. With every topic I make (the constructive ones) I'm trying to tweak WG or at least make them look at a subject and see if it actually needs change. So no, I'm not complaining about my application process. I'm complaining about THE application process. -------------------- Dragon Claws Drops: 1 2 Dragonic Visage Drops: 1 Ruined Dragon Drops: 1 Abyssal Whip Drops: 1 2 | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 07:56 pm | |||||
| IRC Nickname: [Narita] Group: Guest Posts: 695 Member No.: 1378 Joined: October 15, 2008 Total Events Attended: 34 | i was active had 5 refs etc still took me a month get over it -------------------- | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 08:49 pm | |||||
| IRC Nickname: Brian|30 Group: Ex-Member Posts: 565 Member No.: 1547 Joined: December 13, 2008 Total Events Attended: 75 |
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Posted: December 28, 2008 08:52 pm | |||||
| IRC Nickname: Lefty Group: Emeritus Posts: 3340 Member No.: 1055 Joined: June 30, 2008 Total Events Attended: 211 | As we have been saying, it is quite short. There have been changes that were made yesterday, and I am sure that will change the way things work. However, you don't have to take the month, and I personally graduated within 2 weeks. It is not that hard if you are active with events and talk to everyone, making friends. -------------------- | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 09:03 pm | |||||
| IRC Nickname: Brian|30 Group: Ex-Member Posts: 565 Member No.: 1547 Joined: December 13, 2008 Total Events Attended: 75 |
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Posted: December 28, 2008 09:31 pm | |||||
| IRC Nickname: Trolls trolling trolls trolling trolls Group: Banned Posts: 2956 Member No.: 422 Joined: April 4, 2008 Total Events Attended: 130 |
That's where promotions come in ~Mugger84 -------------------- Mugger84 Member Of WG Since 4th April 2008. WG Raid Leader Since 20th June 2008. WG Council Since 20th November 2008. Banned from WG Since 6th March 2009. DF IG Since 6th March 2009. DF FA Since 15th March 2009. Ex-Member Of WG Since 26th March 2009. Member of DF Since 6th April 2009. Clan Friend of WG Since 4th June 2009. --- ||Ex-WG Warlord || Current Member of DF || Ex-Rampage Leader || | ||||
Posted: December 28, 2008 11:40 pm | |||||
| IRC Nickname: Lefty Group: Emeritus Posts: 3340 Member No.: 1055 Joined: June 30, 2008 Total Events Attended: 211 |
That is not changing ideas. I said from the beginning that it is not that hard and the process is not that long. -------------------- | ||||
Posted: December 29, 2008 12:32 am | |||||
 IRC Nickname: rachellove Group: Council Posts: 6955 Member No.: 173 Joined: January 31, 2008 Total Events Attended: 305 | omg meanie meanie meanie..... Don't be so mean. This isn't the first person to point out our application process needed some work. Thank you Elias for taking care of it. Even if he had thought of leaving, he had 3 days. He stayed end of story. How many staff members posted leaving topics and still got promoted within a short time of it. Stop being bias to him. He is a nice guy and I think he will fit in nicely. --------------------  Thank you Garrett and Dallar. “The day soldiers stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them. They have either lost confidence that you can help them or concluded that you do not care. Either case is a failure of leadership.” ~~Colin Powell ~~  | ||||
Posted: December 29, 2008 03:54 am | |||||
 IRC Nickname: Valdremia Group: Ex-Member Posts: 289 Member No.: 64 Joined: December 31, 2007 Total Events Attended: 9 |
Wise line. -------------------- "I will listen to you, especially when we disagree." - Barack Obama  | ||||
The loooooong process of being a member of WG, Rant by 30 Str 0wnz