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"You are a Wilderness Guardian. That northern wasteland; that land of blood, desolation and death is your dominion. Tonight we are going home." ~His Lordship |
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Posted: February 4, 2009 12:58 am  | |||||||||||||||
     IRC Nickname: {Rene} Group: Guest Posts: 838 Member No.: 267 Joined: February 25, 2008 Total Events Attended: 55    | In this topic I will be highlighting points that I know I have been guilty of. If you wish to attack me on this point then I'd like to bring out an old quote "Let thee without sin, cast the first stone." This topic will be rather lengthy, for this reason I ask of you to please not respond untill you have read it all and if I notice that you haven't read it all from your post I will simply ignore it. ---------------- Now where does this topic originate from? Well it comes from an irc conversation from a former council member and current Wg member. I will post the log below (with the name starred out for his own privacy), please read it since this is what started my way thinking like Wg of this. I have also refrained from putting in some things which were also mentioned in this topic because I don't truly believe in them/don't feel Wg is ready for it.
Cut off the convo here, following things in this convo will be slightly adressed at the very end of this post. (Note: I know that I've given a certain view of mine about the current council elections, however this is not the issue being adressed in this topic so if you wish to discuss that feel free to do this in pm with me.) ------ Now there are some other matters that I'll be adressing. But first I'll give you a quick run down of the 3 points I will be adressing: - Council and Tertiaries attitude - Members attitude - Warring/fighting - Ending conclusion The first two points are the main reason why I made this topic. ------ Leadership Team their attitudes There are several things that have been bugging me about the leadership their attitudes lately. Yes, it had been hard on you guys. However you should realise that this is part of the job description that comes with being a Council member/Event leader/ Raid Leader. There has never been a time in Wg where council members had it easy and there were always members attacking the council. Sometimes justified and sometime for bs reasons. Am I trying to say this justifies all the attacks on the council? No, not at all. I am trying to say however that council is no walk in the park. It is not a rank that you take up and freeload on like the Guardian - Elite Guardian ranks. Not just council but tertiaries as well. You know this, you've heard it before. I know. I've been around, I've held the rank of warlord in a clan before and I've also seen many council and tertiaries in Wg come and go. All of these people have been given equal amounts of shit. There have been people who've had it worse and there have been people who've had it easier during their leadership period. But they'll all agree on one thing with me. Any sort of leadership position is the most ungrateful position to be in. Another issue that I'd like to adress is how there is no more humility in Council and Tertiares. Something I've recently seen happening more often is them stating quite blatantly or showing through obvious behaviour: "we're better than you." or "we're more dedicated than you." This is not something that should ever come from a person in a leadership position. Althought there might be some slight truth in it, it is only offensive to members and it isn't needed to form a tight knit community. In a close community ranks and combat levels should be nothing other than a mere formality. A final issue I wish to adress is the issue of bias and favouritism. Now it is normal human behaviour to favour those who are nice to us and to be less strict on those who've shown respect, humbleness and admiration to us. We can't change that but we can lessen it and my main beef is with the bias with knowledge of being biased. Lets be honest. Old school members have been given much more freedom in what they can do and what they can say. Why? Simply because they gained favour and respect among many and even some leaders. However there is no need to make a difference between these members and normal members. At the time of ordeal they are nothing different from a normal member. At this time you should look at the rank and not at the individual. This is the only time when you should apply this train of thought. Always judge people by who they truly are untill the moment of punishment comes. Then is the only time that word/words next to their posts counts for anything. ------ Members their attitudes If there is something that I've been more disappointed about than the leader ship team then it would be the members of the clans. Really, what have you guys been doing? In my opinion there is only one word needed for this section and that is 'pathetic'. Ofcourse it wouldn't be a good rant if I didn't explain further. In these past week(s) I have really seen sides from members that I didn't expect and certain things have been revealed. There are many two faced members in Wg and many don't seem to act like who they truly are and don't seem to say what they truly want to say. First off it doesn't matter if the person you're talking to their name is orange, red or pink. You should speak your thoughts and what you truly think not just what they want to hear. You should be yourself above all other things. Being yourself. It's another thing I've seen not being done by members. We want to talk with you. Not with the person who you wish to be. I see many members acting very two faced. Mostly on Irc. Often times they praise someone when they made a post on the forum and when they're sure that person isn't in Irc they'll talk bad about him behind his back. That's just as bad as those 2 girls who you always had in your class that talked bad about everyone and who nobody really liked. The same with people who just left Irc. First act all nice and as soon as they leave start giving bad commentary about them. Althought it has recently gotten a bit better it happens and it's something that makes me reluctant to to leave irc. Another issue to adress. We are a clan, it's not an 'I' it's a 'we'. Some members need to realise this simple fact. There are people around you in a clan, this is a fact that you have to realise. Although at the end of the day it's still you sitting behind a screen you have to realise that at times it can become more than 'simply a game' this is something Wg has proven and promoted. You have to realise the other people their feelings. Although it's all easy to act tough and shit over the internet please remember that you most likely wouldn't have said that if you could see the other person their face. (This is a reason for the human avatar project. It's a reminder so please do use it ... I'll get around to setting my real life pic as my avvy some time :<) Please do also remember. Just because you know the person the joke is directed at can stand such jokes it does not instantly mean that other people around you in IRC who read that comment can take offense to the comment, you have to bring up understanding for this point and sometimes think before you say something in IRC. Because unlike on the forums, you don't have an edit button. An example would be the council sig incident of last. Rachel apologised for it but still there were people who insulted her for it / nagged her about it. From my understanding it hurt her and offended her a lot. Yes, it's just the internet. But in the tight knit community Wg tries to create these things go further than the simple game. (Not trying to rip open old wounds here. Using an example.) Many of you need to reflect on who are and what you're trying to do here in Wg. What you're hoping to achieve in Wg one day. You don't just have to think of how to make Wg a better place but also on how to make yourself a better person (Make the world a better place, start with yourself. I can't word it better myself.) Old school members. Another issue that I want to adress ... As I brought up earlier in the leadership rant, I feel that an old school member should be judged equal to a normal new member. It shouldn't matter what they did in the past or how long they've been here. They broke the rules and they should be punished. To old school members I'd like to give a shout out as well. It matters not the time you have been in Wg. Talk to new members and respect their opinions. Evaluate their ideas. Just because they don't know how it goes around here doesn't mean that there is no room for change. You are not any more than them and just like them you're a member of the Wilderness Guardians. You should treat them with equal friendliness as those around you. A final issue I wish to adress. Even though the leadership team should be open to your complaints about what they're doing wrong when they truely are doing something wrong you should remember to give them compliments when things are going good and changes for the better are made. You shouldn't simply rant. ------ Fighting sector Well, in all reality we've been doing great and been preforming great in wars. Pkri's are improving as well. Our last wins were great. But there is one thing that's bugging me though. At what price has this all come? Members are looked down upon if they get koed in robes and if they don't bind they'll be nagged even more. Instead of constructive criticisme being given all I see is people giving negative comments which in all reality simply add on to the problem even more and get members who aren't as good even more demotivated. If someone has troubles with lag offer to help them in trying to reduce some of it by helping them clear junk off their comp. If people have trouble with tanking instead of nagging them constantly about it try to ask about how they do it, look at what they do wrong and try to help them out as much as you can. I feel that warring has gone too far beyond the 'friends get together and try to have fun'. It has turned way too competitive and I can understand how some of our members can no longer have fun from attending these wars anymore. ------ Ending Conclusion There ae many problems in Wg at the current time. Mostly with the community. All of these problems have a root though. But msot of them can be fixed by members changing their attitudes. Not just members but some people from the leadership team as well. Because as said in the irc convo. Wg has turned into more of an everyone for themselves place instead of a close knit community. Not just that but the way new members are being ignored is offensive as well. Current members need to accept that if they don't let the new members evolve as themselves that Wg will not be able to change and adapt as needed. Why did I make this post? Was it simply a rant or most of a suggestion? Well I made it because some members need to wake up and start being themselves instead of just acting. Not just that but I want to hear other members opinion. Your opinion not an opinion that others was to see from you. Now to end this off. I have one final question. The same question that was asked in the second half of that Irc convo. What brings us Wg members together? --------------------  | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 4, 2009 01:13 am | |||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Bam Group: Emeritus Posts: 2762 Member No.: 131 Joined: January 20, 2008 Total Events Attended: 111 | have you ever heard the saying "Preaching water and drinking wine"? --------------------   | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 4, 2009 01:34 am | |||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Stokenut Group: Guest Posts: 2062 Member No.: 805 Joined: June 10, 2008 Total Events Attended: 112 |
We kicked ass k. But almost noone remembers, I think I'm the last KF leader left in WG. Those were the days, not just our unrivaled P2P multi skills, but the community was amazing back then, like nothing I've ever seen since. I feel our success in the wilderness was a direct result of our close-knit community of friends. Friends that would fight and die for each other without so much as a question. Friends that played runescape not for the game, but to spend time with each other and enjoy ourselves. Thats the WG I miss. The leaders don't make a clan - it's members do. I skim-read your topic, this is all I have to add. Now I have to stop afking this war. -------------------- Over 6 years of history and friendship, deleted over a difference in an opinion. --- Challenge any creationist to a debate. They'll run away and aggressively accuse you of "attacking" them and their "beliefs". I'm sorry, please, keep teaching our kids that they'll burn in hell if they don't believe. Mutilate their genitals against their will while you're at it. Keep influencing politics and holding back vital scientific research. I'll just keep my mouth shut to "respect" your "beliefs". | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 4, 2009 02:23 am | |||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Robertw56 Group: Guest Posts: 1908 Member No.: 15 Joined: December 29, 2007 Total Events Attended: 118 | Pretty much what Stoke said. I did read your post  --------------------    | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 4, 2009 02:31 am | |||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: megajayson Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 9246 Member No.: 423 Joined: April 4, 2008 Total Events Attended: 216 | interesting. --------------------  This is ten percent luck, twenty percent skill Fifteen percent concentrated power of will Five percent pleasure, fifty percent pain And a hundred percent reason to remember the name! 7th Highest Overall for Wars Attended. | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 4, 2009 03:27 am | |||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Kero2|bryan Group: Guest Posts: 1302 Member No.: 91 Joined: January 2, 2008 Total Events Attended: 26 | Whut stoke said tbh. Back during the ages of mocha / ken / stoke , we didnt give a shit about pixels or anything. If one of us knew were holding the clan back they thrived to help. Uno people say WG's community is better then ever. I'd say your wrong, but dont get me wrong WG's community is better then half the rs a clans atm. Tbh i think its pixels and the secrecy thats stopping us from being a close knit community. -------------------- Best pure f2p Guardian Post here http://www.wildernessguardians.com/forum/i...owtopic=20&st=0   | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 4, 2009 03:52 am | |||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Lefty Group: Emeritus Posts: 3340 Member No.: 1055 Joined: June 30, 2008 Total Events Attended: 211 | I read the complete thing. 
I believe that if we followed what Elias originally said about having an old-school P2P PvP war, then we could bring back this feeling. We have been going after RAW ranks (which I think are honestly kinda useless) and avoiding the point of wars, or what they were for. I know I am a newer member, and I know that I don't know much about the days before the ditch, or during the old wilderness, but I do know from reading and watching that the old school wars was where everyone bonded. Helping each other get the magic levels and the money to get a set of mystic, watching Elias's war preparation videos, getting pumped up massing for the war; those are the things that I believe would bring the community together. Honestly, to raid leaders/warlords, let's get a P2P PvP war, full out. Let's bring our memories back to the old days. Find a clan that honors old school PKing as much as we should and know that it is something that is made to put each of our communities together more than it is for the win. Other than that, I agree on some other points that you have mentioned. Newer members (I know I do it) fall behind the old school members because you get the sense of seniority even though they may be a lower or equal rank as you. Everyone should just fit together regardless of the amount of time spent within the clan. I think that is about it for now.... --------------------      | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 4, 2009 04:47 am | |||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Jenny Group: Emeritus Posts: 1967 Member No.: 19 Joined: December 29, 2007 Total Events Attended: 56 | I do agree that there are a lot of "cliques" and the fact that people can feel isolated from each other. I feel like that myself and it keeps me from wanting to bond. I believe that we are stronger together than we are apart and no matter if you are old/new school there is still the fact you are a guardian and that counts more than anything else. --------------------   | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 4, 2009 04:48 am | |||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Brian|30 Group: Ex-Member Posts: 565 Member No.: 1547 Joined: December 13, 2008 Total Events Attended: 75 | We tend to summarize long periods of time into the memorable moments and I think that's what we are doing here. Sure, we had some great times back then and were pretty tight nit, but we can't keep looking back at the old times and wish we were there, we have to do something about the present. What people don't remember about times like this is all the things that rocked our clan and how we pulled through it. I don't think we realize how great of a community we have. We practically know everyone by their first name, their personal problems, their Runescape problems, and their personalities. We still act like a family, we have our quarrels like families do. We can't get everyone to become exactly what we want them to be; after all, we are a clan based around a game whose players generally lack maturity of any kind. This means that the more successful we are in the fighting sector, the more divided we may become in the community due to more members needing to join, and members that tend to play Runescape to play Runescape, and not for the community. One complaint I have is the loss of respect for leaders. I tend to remember clan members following every demand a clan leader tells them, and that seemed to change as people tend to be more rebellious, not knowing they're really hurting the clan. I tried to talk with some of them, but they say they play Runescape to have fun, and not for the community. This saddens me that they are so much a part of WG and yet so far away from it. WG has been my family for the past years; the only reason I came back to Runescape was for it and it's members but I shouldn't judge WG for a couple of it's members. Sorry if I got a little offtracked from the main topic, it's kinda late and I tried reading what I could with a terrible headache. -------------------- Dragon Claws Drops: 1 2 Dragonic Visage Drops: 1 Ruined Dragon Drops: 1 Abyssal Whip Drops: 1 2 | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 4, 2009 08:18 am | |||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Flippie||Afk Group: Clan Friend Posts: 1708 Member No.: 55 Joined: December 31, 2007 Total Events Attended: 0 | I've read it all. I'll reply later. Class is about to start  -------------------- http://www.myspace.com/ZitherBand Support my Friends!  | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 4, 2009 11:50 am | |||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: rachellove Group: Council Posts: 6955 Member No.: 173 Joined: January 31, 2008 Total Events Attended: 305 | I read all of it. I probably have an entirely different view about the community then most. I approach many members and chat to them often in pm. I often hear newer members say things like "I feel like such a noob." I try to assure them that it's not like that. Then I see it in irc and everyone thinks its a joke but these new trial end up just posting goodbyes. I had past issues with someone that rejoined and was concerned about his return. I find that person is sooo awesome and helpful. I could of just let past experience guide me, but I decided that everyone needs a new start or a second chance. To often we see our members as who they once were and forget about who they may have become. (Rick Hamm comes to mind here too.) I have to agree about the pressure of warring and success. But even when we win, still many hear about KO and you need to do this or that. Sometimes it may seem like your judging fairly, but in the end it would be better to correct in love then to judge at all. --------------------  Thank you Garrett and Dallar. “The day soldiers stop bringing you their problems is the day you have stopped leading them. They have either lost confidence that you can help them or concluded that you do not care. Either case is a failure of leadership.” ~~Colin Powell ~~  | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 4, 2009 02:03 pm | |||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Kwaichi Group: Ex-Member Posts: 1827 Member No.: 65 Joined: December 31, 2007 Total Events Attended: 119 | Everything is changing evey second and nothing can be the same. Everything can be just better or worse than it was. So, if the community was so great like everyone says, its really hard to have a better one now or in the future. About the councils, and voting etc. No comment (just one word, i am fine with recent leadership)... And wars? In general the time ( you get tired of warring if you are warring for several years) and Jagex are the main reasons, i am sure i dont need to remember you on the day when old wilderness gone...  Something returned now, but the chance of loot you can get is really low. At that time when your clan won a war, everyone was returning with some rune items, even if you were low level and didnt get a kill, you could see a lot of rune items on the ground and pick some. Also you were loosing you items so the there wasnt like 2-3 wars a week; the war was a "spiciall event". Now its just about 100 ppl limit, binds and druidic robes + combat levels ( and if we want to compete with elite clans we need it all ). Fun at wars ? ... i think we could have more fun wars. Anyways, i enjoy the wars (if i dont get KOed at the begining  ) but i recognize war practise is more funny 
I always hear just 3 names ... Kenshl + Stoke + Mocha ... i think thats the pople who bought the all community together that time. We need someone like them again (is not even better ) who would stick the whole clan together.. but if they were the best, who can be better ?  --------------------  | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 4, 2009 04:31 pm | |||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: {Rene} Group: Guest Posts: 838 Member No.: 267 Joined: February 25, 2008 Total Events Attended: 55 | This needs more views. I feel people aren't taking this very serieus at all. I'll post responses to posts after I finish my hw. -------------------- | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 4, 2009 06:54 pm | |||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Karlfischer Group: Ex-Member Posts: 664 Member No.: 124 Joined: January 12, 2008 Total Events Attended: 55 |
That is exactly the problem, that instead of saying, "Why doesn't the clan come together as a community, starting with me", people say "Why don't we just hope for some kind of savior to bring the community together." People forget the own impact that they can make on the clan, and instead act as if the health of the clan hinges on the prominence of certain individuals. The sad part is that it becomes true because people are so willing to defer power onto individuals who are driven primarily by their own ego. It becomes a kind of symbiotic relationship where the clan benefits by getting stronger, and the individual "saviors" of the clan get a huge ego boost by pretending the clan literally revolves them. The problem is then, what happens when the ego of our saviors has been satisfied and they get bored and decide to move on? I have seen it enough to know what does happen, the clan starts to collapse or decline under its own weight. Our growth comes back to haunt us, as we find out that many of our members have more loyalty to the "savior" than to the clan, and the rest of the clan has become dependent followers (albeit a lot of these people will think themselves to be leaders) who have no idea how to manage a clan without some individual taking all the responsibility. Another Kenshln is not what we need. He might help us grow in the short term, but does anyone remember what happened when Kenshln left us? What we need is to stop being so dependent on egomaniacs to make this clan great. --------------------   | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 5, 2009 11:03 pm | |||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: {Rene} Group: Guest Posts: 838 Member No.: 267 Joined: February 25, 2008 Total Events Attended: 55 | Karl has summed up what I wanted to post soon. 2006 were great fighting wise. But not so great community wise. It's a clan. Not a one man show. On this note I refuse to post any form of detailed post untill I see a council member post a detailed response on this topic. I know that you've read it. So atleast you shouldn't be afraid to voice your opinion on it. Same goes for the council applicants (with the exception of Rachel) and I can hardly call Jadi his post constructive in any way. -------------------- | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 5, 2009 11:06 pm | |||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 7306 Member No.: 47 Joined: December 30, 2007 Total Events Attended: 343 | I've read it but I dislike posting on issues such as this since I lack the command of the English language to express myself on a broad spectrum with enough detail to satisfy you, if you want my opinion you can find me. -------------------- July 5, 2007 - June 27, 2011 | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 6, 2009 01:10 am | |||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Mmangler Group: Emeritus Posts: 1595 Member No.: 1580 Joined: December 24, 2008 Total Events Attended: 165 | I nominate Joe for work smith. All kidding aside, thank you Renegade for your candid remarks. One of the qualities that I value in this clan is the maturity to allow and accept differing points of view. I am relatively new to this clan and clans in general. Some of the issues that you raise are entirely valid and I believe that everyone should step back and think about why you play RS and why you joined WG. In a nut shell, you are playing RS and joined WG for your personal enjoyment and barring economic or social developments you will stop playing or post a goodbye because it no longer "fits" your goals. In my limited time with WG, I have found that there are a number of people that really love warring and others who do not. WG caters to both groups but now there is an increasing emphasis on warring and increasing friction because not everyone desires to war. My hope is that an accommodation can be reached so that WG can continue to grow and prosper. -------------------- | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 6, 2009 07:31 am | |||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Gorgemaster Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 9840 Member No.: 3 Joined: December 26, 2007 Total Events Attended: 540 | Before my reply begins, I would just like to say that I disagree with this topic being posted.... I know the topic isn't about this... but why did you include your conversation about the current council elections.... Personally for me, (bearing in mind that I am running in the election), it made me feel quite.... how to put it.. disappointed... from your post and general demeanour I can tell that if you were Higher Guardian you would have run for council. Just because you couldn't, don't put us (the applicants) down... saying the elections are rigged (which I must add is completely untrue) is telling the clan that whoever gets elected, only got elected because of rigging. That is the silliest thing I have ever heard.... and its going to cause more e-drama..... You talk about gangs/groups in WG and how you want to get rid of it. Dream on. This is a clan yes, but it is run by HUMAN BEINGS, it contains HUMAN BEINGS and naturally HUMAN BEINGS form groups. It's human nature to find friends and stick with them. As a staff member I don't do this, sure I have people who I am more friendly with than others (again human nature), but I go around and talk to everyone. You address tertiary + council attitudes. Apparently you Rene, you think that we are arrogant, stuck up and think that we are higher than everyone else... Well in a way... I guess that's human nature again... power does change people, some in different ways, some in bad ways, but others react to the power given to them and use it to help people. I would like to think that I am the latter, along with my colleagues and the council.... Member attitudes- I can't believe you are endorsing e-drama and telling people to state their opinions about others, EVEN IF it is going to cause drama.... Warring Attitudes: We nag if you don't bind because binding WINS wars....it separates the men from the little boys... i'll say it again BINDING WINS WARS and so does attendance. Constructive criticism- you say there is none, lies. the constructive criticism is the raid leaders/warlords posting recaps and asking you to attend tank practices. WG is (essentially) a warring clan. You can't expect to be in it, if you won't ever war with us  --------------------    | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 6, 2009 09:57 am | |||||||||||||||
 IRC Nickname: Rage|Mike Group: Clan Friend Posts: 1948 Member No.: 1238 Joined: July 29, 2008 Total Events Attended: 132 | Quite a long post mate, I've read some parts but I've got to go, I'll come back in 4 hours or so and I'll read it. --------------------  MSN: [email protected] IRC: Rage|Mike at SwiftIRC and SeersIRC Drop me a comment, click to view my RSC profile! Proud to be ex-Wilderness Guardian. | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 6, 2009 02:50 pm | |||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rage|Mike Group: Clan Friend Posts: 1948 Member No.: 1238 Joined: July 29, 2008 Total Events Attended: 132 | I disagree with some parts here mate. First off, you criticized some parts of the clan, but I have to criticise one part of you (Don't take it as offensive, it really is meant as constructive criticism to make you an even better person) The problem is that sometimes you really can be hard on the clan mate, nothing is better than a good rant. But sometimes making a load of rants and less 'good job' sorta posts can be very demoralizing. I'll give you one recent example: The last planned PKRI we had. I personally and many others realize we didn't do the best performance ever, but we congratulated and thanked the clan because we finally made a step for change, slow or fast doesn't matter, it can only get better with experience. While you mate (No offence here) critcised the whole PKRI and had a negative view over it. Now don't get me wrong here, as I said, a good rant or a negative view IS helpful so long as you do it every once in a while and not always. I consider you a friend, don't take what I said personal, I had to say it because really no one's perfect, I personally even admit that I have problems of my own
Here I also have to add a note: Most of the 'Old school vs New School' died down really, I personally am new school and I'm treated fairly and with respect by almost all old schoolers, I'm not even what you consider a 'popular' member and yet still I have lots of old school friends.
Honestly here, if you really want to see competitive fights, then check these: http://www.zybez.net/community/index.php?showtopic=1189344 http://www.zybez.net/community/index.php?showtopic=1191418 http://www.zybez.net/community/index.php?showtopic=1189521 These are few mere examples of what can be called a competitive fight. What WG is doing in my personal view is few fun Raids and PKRI's, none of what we do can be considered, in my personal view, a serious competitive fight. A serious fight would be over 5 hours for a PKRI, and in the hundreds for wars. I'm not asking for that, really I'm not, I personally only ask that we have few (Maybe 3-4) PKRI's per month, with few raids. It's not really much considering the fact we have over 1 week prep for most of them. Other than that, you mentioned some good points, I agree with some and disagree with some that has been mentioned by others previously. -------------------- MSN: [email protected] IRC: Rage|Mike at SwiftIRC and SeersIRC Drop me a comment, click to view my RSC profile! Proud to be ex-Wilderness Guardian. | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 6, 2009 05:15 pm | |||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: {Rene} Group: Guest Posts: 838 Member No.: 267 Joined: February 25, 2008 Total Events Attended: 55 | I know I said that I wouldn't respond to posts but I find that these two posts do deserve a response. Also George, I'm going to pretend you didn't post the first part of your post and completely tried to divert the topic off of the subject it is concerning. Pm me if you do want to discuss it. Above all I found it very offensive in the way how you seemed to use my name in a degenerative manner and the way you adressed the first thing in your post.
It is normal to be more friendly with some people and not as friendly with others. On the other hand it isn't normal to surpress newer members and intimidate them into not stating their opinion or looking down on them. The simply excuse stating that it's just a habit is all good and well. But it shows maturity when you can surpress these habits.
I don't simply think this. The main thing that point was based on was on a certain Tertiary stating "Us ranked members are more dedicated than guardians" in Irc. This offended me a lot and even if there is a certain truth in it, it's the same as telling us 'you're replaceable, we're not.'. Above all when talking to council members I feel that they simply believe that no matter what they are right and we are wrong.
I never said they should state opions of others towards those people. I did say that the comments about others as soon as they leave irc are unnecesary.
Since when was it all about winning wars and not about fun? Whether we lost a war or we won it back then was not important. What was important back then was the amount of fun we had while doing it. --------------------------- @Mike: Don't worry I won't hold any grudges for what you posted. Since it is true. Although I would like to know which disagreements with certain points you meant? As far as I've read I don't see anything noteworthy argumented other than the misinterpreted part of my post regarding Kenshln and 2006 which Karl seemed to have cleared up for me.
I know of this myself. I know that I give a lot of negative views and very few compliments. I mainly do this because the Wg members give enough compliments by themselves and so I am there to counter weight these compliments with my posts. I know that it wouldn't hurt to give soem compliments. However if I start throwing around compliments for every thing we do in the correct direction then the compliments will lose all meaning.
Well it is great that it has turned out this way for you but I do know of members who do feel/did feel that way.
I mean the way that wars are no longer aimed to be fun but the main aim is winning the wars. It's not about doing our best and having fun while doing so but it's more about HAVING to have that and HAVING to do that and HAVING to get that. This is what I meant with being competitive. Not just this but also the way of aiming for ranks and only seeming to do our best for ranks. --- Thanks for the response Mike and George. -------------------- | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 6, 2009 06:24 pm | |||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Gorgemaster Group: Elite Guardian Posts: 9840 Member No.: 3 Joined: December 26, 2007 Total Events Attended: 540 | I refrain from posting twice on a topic of this nature, however under the circumstances I feel that I must. You know that it was not my intention to "hurt" you... you just take things way too seriously sometimes Rene... you have to lighten up and let the staff do their jobs. There's one more thing I would like to address... It's been said before, but I will say it again, you need to stop dwelling on the old days. WG in the past was good, it was great, I never knew it, you need to put it behind you (everyone does) and move on, look to the future of WG and the joys we can have... The past will never re-live itself in exactly the same way, glory is different now in the clan world than it was 3 years ago, things change and every clan and every member has to change with these changes, so that no one is left behind. It's not particularly nice to Elias, the current council and the current stuff if you keep saying that previous staff/council did it better.... That sir is demoralizing..... ~disclaimer: this is just the opinion of Gorgemaster, it is not a flame bait... -------------------- | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 6, 2009 07:05 pm | |||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: Rick Hamm Group: Ex-Member Posts: 573 Member No.: 1214 Joined: July 14, 2008 Total Events Attended: 6 | I've read it all but can't, for the life of me, post how I feel or what I think due to some people around here. Let me just say, Rene, you're spot on with a few minor adjustments. I'll wait until I get my warning levels in check and THEN post....deal?  -------------------- | ||||||||||||||
Posted: February 6, 2009 07:16 pm | |||||||||||||||
| IRC Nickname: {Rene} Group: Guest Posts: 838 Member No.: 267 Joined: February 25, 2008 Total Events Attended: 55 |
Well I'll be damned. Last time I said something I was told to 'post a suggestion' and when I do post it I get told to 'simply let the leadership team handle it'. Could you lot please make up your minds? Maybe I do refer a bit too much to the past. But at times you have to look at the past to go forward in the present. Take a look at the Ancient times for example. Or for example the Constitution which is practically based on the Magne Charta. Even then it doesn't change the fact that these issues exist in Wg and that they should be treated. Nowhere in my post did I say the past leadership team was better. Please do quote me if I did so and I'll correct so. -------------------- | ||||||||||||||
The issues with Wg at the time