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My dear friends
By rachellove9 on 07/10/2009
To the staff:
I am very thankful for all you have done in the past, I acknowledge that none of you have an easy job. That your time is truly a gift to the clan. I could never truly understand all that you give as I am not staff and have never been staff.
But as you all know, when you take your positions, you agree to certain things and know that there are rough times ahead of you in leadership. We have a caring and loving community in WG that puts their trust in you to lead us to greater places and happy times. You cannot be letting your pride, misleading truths, and petty self interests guide you as leaders. By yielding to these things, you are allowing the clan to be weakened, our willingness to follow impaired and the clan to severely suffer.
Please do the right thing, you’re the leadership that shows the way. We can feel the troubling times ahead and hear the threatening remarks of each other. Help us sort the things we cannot change, and have the courage to change the things you can before it is to late. This is the hard part, you either need to step down from your positions or renew your commitment to leading us in wars/raids/events/irc/forum and all aspects of the clan. We are brothers and sisters in the clan and no one really wants to hurt each other.
Your reward will be great only in the love and respect that the clan will give you. I hope this will encourage you all to be active. I would rather celebrate the renewed Wilderness Guardians then see it crumbling away from inactivity.
I hope you realize this is all meant in the most loving way. If I can do anything to help, I will do my best to fulfill those needs as well.
Rachy
I am very thankful for all you have done in the past, I acknowledge that none of you have an easy job. That your time is truly a gift to the clan. I could never truly understand all that you give as I am not staff and have never been staff.
But as you all know, when you take your positions, you agree to certain things and know that there are rough times ahead of you in leadership. We have a caring and loving community in WG that puts their trust in you to lead us to greater places and happy times. You cannot be letting your pride, misleading truths, and petty self interests guide you as leaders. By yielding to these things, you are allowing the clan to be weakened, our willingness to follow impaired and the clan to severely suffer.
Please do the right thing, you’re the leadership that shows the way. We can feel the troubling times ahead and hear the threatening remarks of each other. Help us sort the things we cannot change, and have the courage to change the things you can before it is to late. This is the hard part, you either need to step down from your positions or renew your commitment to leading us in wars/raids/events/irc/forum and all aspects of the clan. We are brothers and sisters in the clan and no one really wants to hurt each other.
Your reward will be great only in the love and respect that the clan will give you. I hope this will encourage you all to be active. I would rather celebrate the renewed Wilderness Guardians then see it crumbling away from inactivity.
I hope you realize this is all meant in the most loving way. If I can do anything to help, I will do my best to fulfill those needs as well.
Rachy
By ThisIsUnique on 07/10/2009
I agree
By For Sooth on 07/10/2009
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To the staff: I am very thankful for all you have done in the past, I acknowledge that none of you have an easy job. That your time is truly a gift to the clan. I could never truly understand all that you give as I am not staff and have never been staff. But as you all know, when you take your positions, you agree to certain things and know that there are rough times ahead of you in leadership. We have a caring and loving community in WG that puts their trust in you to lead us to greater places and happy times. You cannot be letting your pride, misleading truths, and petty self interests guide you as leaders. By yielding to these things, you are allowing the clan to be weakened, our willingness to follow impaired and the clan to severely suffer. Please do the right thing, you’re the leadership that shows the way. We can feel the troubling times ahead and hear the threatening remarks of each other. Help us sort the things we cannot change, and have the courage to change the things you can before it is to late. This is the hard part, you either need to step down from your positions or renew your commitment to leading us in wars/raids/events/irc/forum and all aspects of the clan. We are brothers and sisters in the clan and no one really wants to hurt each other. Your reward will be great only in the love and respect that the clan will give you. I hope this will encourage you all to be active. I would rather celebrate the renewed Wilderness Guardians then see it crumbling away from inactivity. I hope you realize this is all meant in the most loving way. If I can do anything to help, I will do my best to fulfill those needs as well. Rachy
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This.
While it may be "funny" for you to be inactive. It's really not. (New staff excepted)
By Pyroclastic0 on 07/10/2009
I don't think some of the staff can help begin inactive and the majority are actually active.
By rachellove9 on 07/10/2009
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I don't think some of the staff can help begin inactive and the majority are actually active. |
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Kyle is very good council. I agree some have reasons.
By Bassism on 07/10/2009
Possibly the most ambiguous suggestion I've ever read. Was this just an activity rant?
By For Sooth on 07/10/2009
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Possibly the most ambiguous suggestion I've ever read. Was this just an activity rant? |
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Yes. But not a clan activity. BUt rather a staff activity rant.
By Bassism on 07/10/2009
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Yes. But not a clan activity. BUt rather a staff activity rant. |
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Ooo burn.
Everyone knows how hard staff apparently is, but the truth is, 90% of you actually don't. I'm balancing about 4 things as it is, but still manage to at least do my forum/IRC job. Sure I might not be as RS active as some people, but the truth is, you don't NEED me to make events. Check the non-PVP events forum, ANYONE can make a non-PVP event.
I don't see any member made/ran events, all it takes is, 2-3 members to make an event and there's 2-3 events a week, and if attendance is taken I can go in and update it, as well as moderating the forums, and all the other stuff I do on the side. RS activity is a tiny portion of what Event Leaders do. I know I speak for David as well (Who has just started University), but we Event Leaders spend most of our time doing forum work, rather than playing the game, because we don't have time to do both and have to prioritise.
We've just got 2 new Raid Leaders who have already filled out our weekend with PVP events, so I don't know what the problem with PVP activity is.
Council are as active as always, maybe they don't play the game as much, but they're on forums daily, IRC almost daily.
I'll be honest, Event Leaders are basically glorified Moderators, any member can step up and do our in game work such as creating and leading events, and so far I've only ever seen one member do that, and that's Dylan (HeavenlyBolt). It's what we do behind the scenes that members don't seem to care about, who do you think is updating your attendance? Who is keeping the forums clean? That'd be us.
By rachellove9 on 07/10/2009
So Owen are you suggesting that we don't need event leaders but moderators instead? I am not sure I can agree with that. If that was the case then just make you all council and still you're allowed to do events. Then apps and things would be done quicker.
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I am very thankful for all you have done in the past, I acknowledge that none of you have an easy job. That your time is truly a gift to the clan. I could never truly understand all that you give as I am not staff and have never been staff. |
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I clearly state in my post that I could never truly understand all that you give. I am in no way putting any one down for all the work that they do. I actually appreciate and have gratitude for it.
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I'll be honest, Event Leaders are basically glorified Moderators, any member can step up and do our in game work such as creating and leading events, and so far I've only ever seen one member do that, and that's Dylan (HeavenlyBolt). It's what we do behind the scenes that members don't seem to care about, who do you think is updating your attendance? Who is keeping the forums clean? That'd be us. |
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Are you forgetting Ludo Slayer? In August he did so many events. I sometimes do a few. But sometimes it is more the push to get the staff to have the events that are actually scheduled on time. I've worked my real life schedule around coming to events to only come on and the person to lead isn't on or they changed the time. I see the disappointment in the new trials and guardians when this happens. Sometimes you have to look beyond your own personal needs. Remember that as a member, we have to have 8 attend our event or we do not get attendance.
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Council are as active as always, maybe they don't play the game as much, but they're on forums daily, IRC almost daily. |
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So to you any one applying for council does not need to be active? Basically that is what you're trying to tell me.
I disagree totally with this statement. An active council means an active clan. When the leaders go into a slumpy activity, we see many issues come into the clan that would otherwise not be here. I remember Stevepants being extremely active council, Glennfase was also very active til his rl issues pulled him away. But Glenn knew he was to inactive to give WG the required time. This is the difference.
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We've just got 2 new Raid Leaders who have already filled out our weekend with PVP events, so I don't know what the problem with PVP activity is. |
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I'm sure our raid leaders will help us by planning events. If we expect and want the members to come to things, it needs to be the staff being active too. It is a proven fact so many times in WG that active leaders equals active clan. Talk to Gene and see if he agrees with this statement. The leaders are what should be motivating the clan.
I actually miss George being on with us even if it is just for tears. It's not cause I can't do the events with out him, but that he is my friend and I would rather do them with him. I would think you could understand this. You have been on both sides as a leader and as a clan member.
Rachy
By Bassism on 07/10/2009
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So Owen are you suggesting that we don't need event leaders but moderators instead? I am not sure I can agree with that. If that was the case then just make you all council and still you're allowed to do events. Then apps and things would be done quicker. |
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Council =/= Moderators, if you were in WG of '05/'06, you would know we had our council and we had moderators, we didn't even have Raid Leaders. Moderators do exactly what their name implies, they moderate, keep the boards clean, and other MOD CP stuff. The council are admin, they make decisions that effect the clan, they set the rules, process applications, and other ADMIN CP stuff. Maybe we do need Moderators instead of Event Leaders.
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Are you forgetting Ludo Slayer? In August he did so many events. I sometimes do a few. But sometimes it is more the push to get the staff to have the events that are actually scheduled on time. I've worked my real life schedule around coming to events to only come on and the person to lead isn't on or they changed the time. I see the disappointment in the new trials and guardians when this happens. Sometimes you have to look beyond your own personal needs. Remember that as a member, we have to have 8 attend our event or we do not get attendance. |
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August? You realise it's now October? Like I said before, you don't need me to lead events, I'm not a babysitter. I've seen Dylan mass up a weekly ToG event.
Could you show me a post that says you need 8 members to attend or you don't get attendance? I know I've given attendance for events run by members with <8 members. Also, if you're not getting 8 members to your events, I don't think that's completely a Staff inactivity problem do you?
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So to you any one applying for council does not need to be active? Basically that is what you're trying to tell me. I disagree totally with this statement. An active council means an active clan. When the leaders go into a slumpy activity, we see many issues come into the clan that would otherwise not be here. I remember Stevepants being extremely active council, Glennfase was also very active til his rl issues pulled him away. But Glenn knew he was to inactive to give WG the required time. This is the difference. |
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I'm not saying a council doesn't need to be active. But there is simply not enough time in the day for Council to do everything WG asks of them as well as their RL stuff and still be able to play the game. They are FORCED to prioritise, and I think they make the right choice by choosing to be Forum/IRC active instead of getting 99 Slayer. What would you rather have? Working forums or 4 council members with all 99 stats? Cos I'll tell you right now, in WG, it's impossible to have both.
By rachellove9 on 07/10/2009
Please read number 2 on this post.
http://www.wildernessguardians.com/forum/i...findpost&p=7145
This rule has been in affect for so long, I'm surprised you didn't know it. I can dig deeper if you want better proof of it.
I see that less than 2 months ago, that if activity is coming from a member does not count? Doesn't that seem double standard to you at all? We have high respect for leaders that served us in the past. Does the rank matter that much, but then you say that any member can do your job? I find this all a little confusing to me.
Rachy
Edit: I personally don't care if they have any 99s. I'd rather see them come to events and play rs with the clan then camp out at some boring spot to just train. It is more about community than it is about the actual rs game.
http://www.wildernessguardians.com/forum/i...findpost&p=7145
This rule has been in affect for so long, I'm surprised you didn't know it. I can dig deeper if you want better proof of it.
I see that less than 2 months ago, that if activity is coming from a member does not count? Doesn't that seem double standard to you at all? We have high respect for leaders that served us in the past. Does the rank matter that much, but then you say that any member can do your job? I find this all a little confusing to me.
Rachy
Edit: I personally don't care if they have any 99s. I'd rather see them come to events and play rs with the clan then camp out at some boring spot to just train. It is more about community than it is about the actual rs game.
By Bassism on 07/10/2009
I'm sorry, I tend not to check announcements from 18 months ago too often.
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I see that less than 2 months ago, that if activity is coming from a member does not count? Doesn't that seem double standard to you at all? |
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I might be being extremely dense but that doesn't make alot of sense to me, could you reword please?
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We have high respect for leaders that served us in the past. Does the rank matter that much, but then you say that any member can do your job? I find this all a little confusing to me. |
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I'm saying any member can do the in game aspect of an Event Leader, that is, create and lead events, but that is a small part of what I do. Which is why I'm about to go suggest that Event Leaders be renamed to Moderators, and that a push for members to create their own events be discussed.
Edit: Executive decision, from now on, any pre arranged event (i.e one that has a topic beforehand) will receive attendance, at the discretion of the Staff.
By rachellove9 on 07/10/2009
I mean that Ludo did us a great service, at the time we were lacking in events. He was a good member and did many for us. I am not going to forget his dedication so quickly.
Good Luck on event leader/moderator. If that is the change they make, I will expect to get new ones as staff voted for you to be event leader not moderator.
Let this be your reminder of what you applied for. What about a month ago???
You cannot just change a position that you were awarded. By applying for the position you agreed to the terms of service. If that is not what you wanted why did you apply?
Rachy
Good Luck on event leader/moderator. If that is the change they make, I will expect to get new ones as staff voted for you to be event leader not moderator.
Let this be your reminder of what you applied for. What about a month ago???
You cannot just change a position that you were awarded. By applying for the position you agreed to the terms of service. If that is not what you wanted why did you apply?
Rachy
By Bassism on 07/10/2009
I'm not saying I won't make events, but it shouldn't just be left to Event Leaders to spoon feed events to the clan. PVP events are different because they require a different expertise to lead.
And actually you didn't vote me for Event Leader. It was a staff decision.
And actually you didn't vote me for Event Leader. It was a staff decision.
By rachellove9 on 07/10/2009
Reread what you agreed to by applying. Yeah I caught my error and had changed that too.
It says several events each week. So start spoon feeding us. It tastes better that way.
It says several events each week. So start spoon feeding us. It tastes better that way.
By Bassism on 07/10/2009
And I'm still willing to do all those jobs, but if members also started being proactive and started making their own events too, it would only help increase activity.
More events = more activity = less need for topics like this.
More events = more activity = less need for topics like this.
By For Sooth on 07/10/2009
So I've randomly held events just from gathering people in IRC, and we've had max like 5 people. Shouldn't that get attendance? I mean that's more people than how many use to go to TOG and Penguin HUnting.
Boiled down. Change the 8 to a 5.
Boiled down. Change the 8 to a 5.
By rachellove9 on 07/10/2009
My point is that you are staff, that comes with responsibility. Start doing what you agreed to when you got the position.
I will try to host a few events each month. But that in no way means that you should be hosting fewer than You must be willing to host several events a week. This is what it comes down to. Someone has to be responsible for clan activity. That is the staff. You are staff. Do your job. I just want staff to be more active.
This is not an easy type post for anyone to have to make or read. Please just do what you promised when you applied for your position. Then I would not find myself in this area of needing to make a post about any of this.
Rachy
I will try to host a few events each month. But that in no way means that you should be hosting fewer than You must be willing to host several events a week. This is what it comes down to. Someone has to be responsible for clan activity. That is the staff. You are staff. Do your job. I just want staff to be more active.
This is not an easy type post for anyone to have to make or read. Please just do what you promised when you applied for your position. Then I would not find myself in this area of needing to make a post about any of this.
Rachy
By Pyroclastic0 on 07/10/2009
I think the requirement to have 8 people to an event is a bit outdated from when we had more members who would attend and probably needs to be reduced to make it more appealing for members to make events but the rule probably would be overlooked with common sense.
okay, maybe more events could be made but people sometimes want days to do their own thing and this week has already been taken up with raids thursday onwards, but I suppose there should always be options as well though.
okay, maybe more events could be made but people sometimes want days to do their own thing and this week has already been taken up with raids thursday onwards, but I suppose there should always be options as well though.
By rachellove9 on 07/10/2009
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I think the requirement to have 8 people to an event is a bit outdated from when we had more members who would attend and probably needs to be reduced to make it more appealing for members to make events but the rule probably would be overlooked with common sense. okay, maybe more events could be made but people sometimes want days to do their own thing and this week has already been taken up with raids thursday onwards, but I suppose there should always be options as well though. |
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I usually have no trouble getting the 8 people but I know for some it is harder.
This post is not just about this week. Anyone can be inactive for even a few weeks. All I'm asking for is more staff activity. No where did I say you can't have rl issues or be busy or any of that. Just if you are staff you need to be active to get the clan to be more active.
I was trying to motivate staff but instead it ended up me defending my position about what I expect from Owen.
Rachy
By Quikdrawjoe on 07/10/2009
People always want staff but they never realize how tough it is then they burn out.
By George on 07/10/2009
I've attended ToG for the last 3 weeks Rach.... you haven't been there...
I'm as active as I can possibly be.
I'm stage managing a semi-professional play this winter... you know exactly what my family situation is like atm.... i'm applying to unis atm... as well as keeping up with my academic studies, so for all that.... I don't think my activity is bad at all.
As Owen said, i'm on IRC twice a day for several hours, on forums 3-4 times a day, I spent my whole weekend doing the Summer Awards which you all said you wanted.
So I don't think this post was really needed.
We're all doing fine - Darth has an excuse, his computer is mucked up atm.
Just because we are council doesn't mean we dont have real life commitments, however those commitments don't mean that we should resign.
Everyone has commitments...
I'm as active as I can possibly be.
I'm stage managing a semi-professional play this winter... you know exactly what my family situation is like atm.... i'm applying to unis atm... as well as keeping up with my academic studies, so for all that.... I don't think my activity is bad at all.
As Owen said, i'm on IRC twice a day for several hours, on forums 3-4 times a day, I spent my whole weekend doing the Summer Awards which you all said you wanted.
So I don't think this post was really needed.
We're all doing fine - Darth has an excuse, his computer is mucked up atm.
Just because we are council doesn't mean we dont have real life commitments, however those commitments don't mean that we should resign.
Everyone has commitments...
By rachellove9 on 07/10/2009
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I've attended ToG for the last 3 weeks Rach.... you haven't been there... I'm as active as I can possibly be. I'm stage managing a semi-professional play this winter... you know exactly what my family situation is like atm.... i'm applying to unis atm... as well as keeping up with my academic studies, so for all that.... I don't think my activity is bad at all. As Owen said, i'm on IRC twice a day for several hours, on forums 3-4 times a day, I spent my whole weekend doing the Summer Awards which you all said you wanted. So I don't think this post was really needed. We're all doing fine - Darth has an excuse, his computer is mucked up atm. Just because we are council doesn't mean we dont have real life commitments, however those commitments don't mean that we should resign. Everyone has commitments... |
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George you took the defensive. I was at Tears with you one of those weeks. No one is expecting you to not have real life commitments.
I was not singling any one out. I am just trying to say that staff sets the pace for activity.
If you really feel I am that far off with my thread then delete it . . . I wasn't trying to be critical of anyone.
Rachy
By Nick on 07/10/2009
With the aim towards the event leader argument, from what I have seen in my year here in WG, all events led or attended by staff get more attention than any other event.
By rachellove9 on 07/10/2009
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With the aim towards the event leader argument, from what I have seen in my year here in WG, all events led or attended by staff get more attention than any other event. |
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This is so true. This only backs up my thoughts on "staff being active bringing better activity to the clan."
By George on 07/10/2009
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George you took the defensive. I was at Tears with you one of those weeks. No one is expecting you to not have real life commitments. I was not singling any one out. I am just trying to say that staff sets the pace for activity. If you really feel I am that far off with my thread then delete it . . . I wasn't trying to be critical of anyone. Rachy
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Yes, but you clearly think there are some people who are inactive amongst the staff or you wouldn't have written this.
So can you clarify (perhaps in a PM) who these people are
<-- confuzzled.
By Quikdrawjoe on 07/10/2009
Hint: A person who plays WoW 
By Snowzak on 08/10/2009
Look, after one or two years of ranting at council members for inactivity I understood one thing:
Attack directly if you want any results. Say the names. Implicits & insinuations only brings argument, debate, case by case shit etc. Vehemence and anger get change, not sweet talk. Don't be scared of hurting people, it's what makes them really reconsider themselves.
I of course don't have any idea what you're talking about since I'm inactive
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Attack directly if you want any results. Say the names. Implicits & insinuations only brings argument, debate, case by case shit etc. Vehemence and anger get change, not sweet talk. Don't be scared of hurting people, it's what makes them really reconsider themselves.
I of course don't have any idea what you're talking about since I'm inactive
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By Nick on 09/10/2009
Every time that I rant about council and include direct references to a point that the people know that I am talking about them, drama is started and I am flamed for flaming council. 
By George on 09/10/2009
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Every time that I rant about council and include direct references to a point that the people know that I am talking about them, drama is started and I am flamed for flaming council.
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Maybe it's the way you do it
The staff want constructive criticism... it is your clan as well as ours and we want support in maintaining clan order and community life.
If you go to someone quietly and suggest that they try to improve their activity, I don't think they will mind.
By rachellove9 on 09/10/2009
It was suppose to help motivate the staff over all. Things just seem to have become less important. I thought a refocus from all staff would be good. The really active staff saw what I was doing and I don't think they had a problem. I'm not even staff . . . I am simply a member that loves the clan.
When staff has over all activity issues with the members, we see an IA about it. No one is usually being singled out. We even get threats of sweeps.
I receive many pms from members and I was just trying to help . . .
Reread my first post it is clear that I like all of you and just want an active staff that is willing to do what they said they would when they applied for their positions. I would not be hearing complaints or put in the position to make this post if you all were doing your part.
It was not directed at any one of you. It is a general post just asking staff to be more active. Why do I need to single anyone out? Those who are doing great know they are and those who are slacking can self examine.
(Owen being the exception here. He decided to take it to a personal level. I told him at a personal level in this post what I think an event leader is from my own point of view and the official view of WG. I don't think it is necessary for me to debate each and every staff member for the entire clan to read. Read level two.)
When staff has over all activity issues with the members, we see an IA about it. No one is usually being singled out. We even get threats of sweeps.
I receive many pms from members and I was just trying to help . . .
Reread my first post it is clear that I like all of you and just want an active staff that is willing to do what they said they would when they applied for their positions. I would not be hearing complaints or put in the position to make this post if you all were doing your part.
It was not directed at any one of you. It is a general post just asking staff to be more active. Why do I need to single anyone out? Those who are doing great know they are and those who are slacking can self examine.
(Owen being the exception here. He decided to take it to a personal level. I told him at a personal level in this post what I think an event leader is from my own point of view and the official view of WG. I don't think it is necessary for me to debate each and every staff member for the entire clan to read. Read level two.)
By Bassism on 09/10/2009
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Owen being the exception here. He decided to take it to a personal level. |
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Bollocks did I take it to a personal level.
By Tweek900 on 10/10/2009
alright, Heres my stand on all of this. And i couldn't care less if it makes you guys hate me or love me. I hope it makes you love me but I dont care as long as it makes you guys open your eyes and makes WG a better place for everyone.
Ok so i just joined WG not to long ago coming from 'The' Clan. I noticed a ton of differances. And i talked to Rachy about them and thats what got her up to making this post.
So to start. If theres a weekly event set for every Monday at 4pm est time. Then every Monday at 4pm that event should be held. Members shouldn't have to set in the lobby and wait for owen to come back because another event leader doesn't want to hold the event. This has happened to me. This makes it look like staff isn't willing to step up. If theres a time for an event then do what you have to so the event happens then no matter what.
Next thing is being active. If staff cant be active and keep there end up by holding there events then members wont be active either. I set in the lobby for 2 hours waiting for owen to come back because leecable didn't want to host the event of peng hunting when it was supost to be going on. That kills it for me. That makes me wonder what i've gotten into. When the staff isn't willing to step up to the plate and back eachother up theres huge problems waiting to happen.
If your a staff member and your not willing to step up to the plate or your to busy in real life to keep up with everything you should be doing then step down from your staff spot and let someone that is able to complete the task take your spot.
Its 2:21am and i've lost what else i wanted to say so i'm going to head to bed now. I hope to hear from you all soon. And people please make sure that lordy read this...
Ok so i just joined WG not to long ago coming from 'The' Clan. I noticed a ton of differances. And i talked to Rachy about them and thats what got her up to making this post.
So to start. If theres a weekly event set for every Monday at 4pm est time. Then every Monday at 4pm that event should be held. Members shouldn't have to set in the lobby and wait for owen to come back because another event leader doesn't want to hold the event. This has happened to me. This makes it look like staff isn't willing to step up. If theres a time for an event then do what you have to so the event happens then no matter what.
Next thing is being active. If staff cant be active and keep there end up by holding there events then members wont be active either. I set in the lobby for 2 hours waiting for owen to come back because leecable didn't want to host the event of peng hunting when it was supost to be going on. That kills it for me. That makes me wonder what i've gotten into. When the staff isn't willing to step up to the plate and back eachother up theres huge problems waiting to happen.
If your a staff member and your not willing to step up to the plate or your to busy in real life to keep up with everything you should be doing then step down from your staff spot and let someone that is able to complete the task take your spot.
Its 2:21am and i've lost what else i wanted to say so i'm going to head to bed now. I hope to hear from you all soon. And people please make sure that lordy read this...
By Snowzak on 10/10/2009
well pvp wise it's true things seem a tad inactive, there aren't really enough events to fit everybody and get two events per week... Making it quite hard to graduate if you're not online at 10-11pm GMT, 4-5 EST
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