The application changes

If we want to fix up our application to correctly demonstrate what we're looking for, I believe we should analyze each and every question and possibly add more as needed.
In my opinion, overall:
-We're not accurately addressing interest and expectations of PvP.
-Our application ask unnecessary questions and is very cluttered.
-The entire process is overly lengthy and at some point confusing.



1. Make a new topic in this forum, in the "Topic Title" field, please type: "Application: YourRsNameHere"
2. In the "Topic Description" Field, please type the current date in dd/mm/yyyy format

This is unnecessary. Their RSN is on their app and the date is on the topic automatically.
This only adds confusion.



1) Please provide a link to your Introduction Topic: (Your Link Here)

This make sense as it proves they have introed.

2) Please provide a full sized screenshot of your Runescape window, showing your friends list with all WG council members on it and at least your in game name visible (Note: They do not have to be online at the time):

(Screenshot Here)
-Rachellove9
-His Lordship
-KevCross
-Airbender
-Megajayson


I believe this shows that they actually own the account.
It also gives us a look at their friendslist which allows us to clan search them & look for suspicious stuff.
I wouldn't call this step exactly necessary but I see no harm in it.

3) Please provide a picture of your account with your username clearly visible with the Trial Guardian Gear

This is necessary because we have had people apply with zero sets and zero cash to buy them.
They would then realize they can't survive in a PvP clan.

4) What is your clan history? [Please list them, include your rank while in the clan, Explain why you left/got banned/forced to leave. Fill out the mini-template]:
Clan Name - Clan Rank - Why you left/got banned/forced to leave

I don't think the italicized part is necessary.
People can't possibly that stupid lol it just adds clutter.

5) What Country are you from? (And if you know it, Timezone) (Your Answer Here)

WG is mostly EST & GMT.
If we get Aussie applicants we should start letting them know.
If they see that most events are at 5 in the morning they'll just end up leaving.

6) On average, how many hours per week would you normally spend on Runescape? of this, how long would you be willing to spend at WG events? (Your Answer Here)

This question is unnecessary and irrelevant.
Some people are casual players and some are very serious.
As long as they can dedicate time to come & stay at events it shouldn't matter.

7) Are you currently a Member of RuneScape, or a Free Player of RuneScape? (Your Answer Here)

If they say F2P we need to decline.
While we have a good amount of F2P events, they simply cannot be a valuable asset to our clan.

8) Please post a picture of your registered username in our IRC Channel. For help with this, post in Guest Talk. (Your Picture Here)

While IRC is important, this question is stupid & adds more clutter.
We should just have them post their nickname and have them PM any hop or op to confirm it.

9) Please tell us your original RuneScape name that you first started this account you are applying with. (Your Answer Here)

Important but easy to lie about.

10) Have you read and agreed to abide by our rules found in step one of the introductions forum? (Your Answer Here)

While we think we're being clever with the copy/paste thing, it doesn't work because people ALWAYS read other apps before applying.
They'll see this done on all the apps and just go find it.
This can only be fixed by moving ALL processed apps to a private forum (most clans do this, btw).




What needs to be added

Do you have any past experience with clan related PvP and warring? (Your Answer Here)

If the answer is no or little we need to post on their app that they should seek help.
This can be done by posting guides & videos.


Do you understand that you are expected to return to all fights when allowed and should keep your return sets stocked at all times? (Your Answer Here)

If no then they can't survive in a PvP clan.
WG is too soft and can't be competing with serious PvP clans.



Discuss

What I agree with the most is question 6. I always gloss over that one.
The two points at the top are also fine by me if you want it to go.

Question 8, disagree. It just would lengthen the time required for process the app, with no major advantage.

Question 7, I think they deserve a chance. I don't want us to become a p2p only clan.

Everything else, I have no dispute with.

Number 6 is more for me then for anyone else. If I have anything that looks the least bit suspicious in the apps or intros (I read both very carefully.) or even a youtube comment or something odd I find when I do the background stuff. I usually search any odd clan names too. Sometimes knowledgeable members will tell me in pm if they see a nh clan on that list as well.

I'm not against moving the apps that are processed to private forum. However I disagree that people catch the color on other apps. Often they don't and have to be redirected to reread our rules.

The IRC needs to stay cause often people aren't willing to try it unless they really need it downloaded for this step. Especially females. It is really hard to recruit females cause they don't like irc and ts.

f2p players are rare to apply anyway. In past year I'll guess maybe 5. Idk that may be a high number so really accepting them isn't an issue. We often have members that run out of money and have to go f2p though. I would not want to kick a member just cause they are broke for a month. It doesn't usually last to long and often other members are generous and give them membership anyway.

About the Aussie applicants. I don't think it has been a huge issue, it's not like we would give them a warn for not getting up at 5 am. You might be surprised at how many of them are out raiding in the middle of our night when I get up at like 3 or 4 pm and sign on. It really seems that the Aussie unit is very close friends and that over time this may help grow that time zone to be as successful as the others. I don't want to deter them from joining. If we get enough of them, maybe someone like Zooby in EL will work out for the good.



I do agree to the changes on intro if you want those and I really like the two new questions to add to the application. Maybe put those closer to the top of the application to help put focus on their importance.

Less pictures would be better, but it is discouraging to see people say 'idk how to take pictures'.

But I don't think we should base all of our stuff on the Application, we should use the Trial Process to its full potential and if we arn't happy with a members activity or pvp experience, then don't allow them to graduate.

An example would be Hoss_I_Am having 0 wars attended and being a Guardian. I'd want to know how he couldn't attend even 1 war and why.

tl;dr - We should work more on the trial process than the Application form.

Kevin and I often talk about the trials. He has pointed out to me the direct relationship to inactive mentors means trials are not good. If you have a mentor who is not constantly reminding and talking to trials then they don't do well. Inactive trials means not graduating trial. We lose members at this step mostly when the mentors go inactive or lack communication to their mentees.


My thoughts on Hoss I Am:

I'm not sure but Hoss I Am said he was 19 or something on his intro. But I was really convinced he was like 12 or 13. If he is 19, he is disabled. He wasn't able to read and understand the questions to well. Kevin and I helped him along the way a good bit. I didn't know him on a personal level at all. If he is disabled and extremely low functioning then he won't last long in WG. He did post one yes and one no on the upcoming pvp events. I would kick him if he doesn't come up to WG standards.

When I was first mentor I used to have to post a comment like once or twice during the trial period to tell council how things were going. It was a separate forum. I'm not sure if that would help or not.

When we went down to 3 mentors, we had better control of it. With the serge of people we have been getting that isn't an option. I only use certain people on our mentor list as last resort. A lot of times I end up helping their mentees anyway.

Yea, I agree with the mentors. We need hard driven people who will constantly be in contact with their mentees.

Even thought Zooby is my friend, he isn't someone I would want to be a mentor. He flames, isn't 100% active, and constantly quits runescape. We should go back to like 3-5 mentors who will do their job at a high standard.

I will review all mentors.

I just removed Flame_Outlaw and Orthux from the mentor list. Cory is less active and Orthux is Emeritus now.

The rest of our mentors are all active, and we have plenty of them.

Actually may not be trimmed down enough for me:

I'm removing

DZ - Doesn't like it so I can ask and add if needed
Joey - Is not Elite
Dan - I think he needs to concentrate more on PVP
Garrett - He is only active on weekends and can be put back on later

That gives us a much better mentor list tbh. Although Alain is not Elite he is one of our best mentors not in staff atm. I'll be reviewing further and choosing who to ask to mentor soon.


These are the Elites I think would be great to add:

ZurvivorMan ~ Extremely concerned with clan things.
Kat ~ Very friendly. I just want to be sure she wants to do it.
Keith ~ I know just back but he is really detailed in mentoring.

I'm not sure I agree with your Orthux decision. I think taking away all his little jobs he helps WG with will only push him further away the clan. He has an odd disorder that makes him not leave his house. WG is one safe place that he actually interacts with people successfully.

Sooooo about the application..

1) - Keep how it is
2) - Keep how it is
3) - Keep how it is
4) - Change/rephrase to: "What is your clan history? Please list them. Include your rank while in the clan, and explain why you left/got banned/forced to leave."
5) - Keep how it is. If we won't to "notify" them that event times may be bad for them, it should be done through like an IRC PM.
6) - I agree with removing this. Rachel, I don't really see how it helps you with background checks.
7) - Change/rephrase to: "Are you currently a F2P or P2P player of RuneScape? (Note: the majority of our events are in P2P)"
8) - Really outdated. We're asking for a registered username, yet are channel doesn't require people to register usernames anymore.
Change/rephrase to: "Please post a picture of yourself in our IRC Channel. Alternatively, ask an official (% or @) to post on your application verifying that you were there."
9) - While easy to lie about, most people will not lie about it, which means we can use it to find background information about them. Keep it.
10) - Keep how it is. I agree with moving processed apps to a private forum. What would the permission be for it? Guardian+? Staff only?

Randy's questions:
- "Do you have any past experience with clan related PvP and warring?"
Change/rephrase to: "What is your experience with clan related PvP and warring?"

- "Do you understand that you are expected to return to all fights when allowed and should keep your return sets stocked at all times?"

Change/rephrase to: "Do you understand that you are expected to return to all fights (when rules allow for returning)?
AND
"Do you understand that you must keep your return sets stocked at all times?"


_______________________________________

Also, do you think we should add a "Do you understand..." question regarding skipping fights and the punishment of doing so?

8. Doesn't it have to be registered to get in #wg either? I sorta thought we are protecting ourselves that they are who they say they are and not like some person just going on their nicknames on irc?

Discuss this one a bit further before removing it. Actually I want to hear Rob's view on it.